Alone with everyone. A virtual network is a special environment that seems to be a mirror of real life. But strange mirror. At least - having its refraction. There is another optics. Therefore, the discussion about the present and future of this strange, strange world of three letters - WWW - was not like any of those that were held in the editorial office over these two years. BFM.ru editor-in-chief Anton Nosik and Mail.Ru Vice President Anna Artamonova-argued. But everyone is with himself and his virtual environment. And both - with The New Times
In conditions when state television channels cover 97% of the audience in all 11 temporary zones of the Russian Federation, the Internet remains the only free platform that connects the country ...
Anton Nosik: Do you know how good we have in India? In India, Ratan Tata made a telecommunication company, which is called without embellishment - Tata Sky. That is, "the sky of Mr. Tata." Tata Sky for $ 20 gives you 800 television channels ... If Internyus, along with Manana Aslamazyan, was not covered by a copper basin due to the desire of the Chekists to control regional television, we would have the same thing. You would have watched personnel of local companies about Vladivostok. Local news is a “gap of head”, as interesting and meaningful. But we are not in India, unfortunately. Russia is currently lagging behind India for the development of economics, high-tech and medicine for a thousand years approximately, in terms of secondary and higher education-for 5 thousand years, on television development-forever ...
Let us return to the "Fatherland of our free ..." for the authorities, does the Internet pose a threat?
Anna Artamonova: Honestly, I can say: we - mail.ru as a company - are apolitical.
Nosik: They have a Zhirinovsky blog. If Anti-Zhirinovsky comes, they will also take it. Kasparov can also open, but they just will not take it to the "muzzle". Well, understandable. There is no censorship on mail.ru.
Send far
If at some point the Chekists will come to your office ...
Nosik: they come all the time - with the sanction of the court to recess certain addresses on IP.
Artamonova: But these are not Chekists.
Nosik: those who conduct investigations come. The FSB also leads them and receives the same sanctions. It can be a slaughter department from Perm. For example, he ordered Killing there on mail ...
Artamonova: Listen, I don't really like this topic at all.
Nosik: My love, this procedure is 10 years old. It occurs wherever there is an email operator. It takes place in Beeline, in MTS, in Megafon. Everyone is required to provide data on the court order.
And how often are such court decisions?
Nosik: This is for slaughter matters. If a person comes and says: “I am a cop, please open me a mailbox of my wife,” he goes to ... without legal grounds - that the police, that the Chekists are walking. We are protected by law very well.
Artamonova: We have no stream of suffering with linden pieces of paper.
And if they come and say: “But you have a citizen Nikonorova wrote something like this by e-mail”?
Nosik: If your personal data begins to transfer to third parties without legal grounds, they will be deprived of a license for this.
That is, there is no electronic correspondence?
Artamonova: No.
Nosik: There is another. There is SORM-2. Each byte that comes from your computer and comes to you, at the level of the cable operator connecting your home and office, is copied to the FSB in Troparev on Raids. 1,36 million people “chat” every day, send a video, take a video - each byte is copied to the FSB. Who will read it? When you need to gut you, they come to you, take your computer. So they took Shirinkin. So took Terentyev. So they took the green. Do not catch on the network. It is impossible to catch the byte of meaning in these terabytes per second G ... on, which we generate.
What is the point of spending money then?
Nosik: Under the "Sorms" very good "grandmas" come. And there are a lot of state, which means the bosses, status, service car, secretary. Parkinson's law works the same world. The same is done by the Americans and the British. And why? You think how much information about its citizens has a Russian state with any of their body movements: when paying for a mobile phone; At the birth of a child - how many pieces of paper should be obtained, where your address, phone, an extract from the personal account and so on are written. The state knows 100 times more about us than any “classmates”, any “in contact”. How many visitors are on mail.ru?
Artamonova: per month - 50 million.
Nosik: Read their correspondence - how much do people need?
It's not about the site
For the Russian state, Mail.ru, which has 50 million visitors per month, poses a threat?
Artamonova: The threat is not.
And if, through Mail.Ru, citizens decide to arrange a “march of disagreements”?
Artamonova: For this, mail.ru is not needed. There is an Internet space. You can make a separate site there and somehow attract people there. It's not about the site - business in people. Funny a communication channel or even a specific Internet site is perceived as a threat. We are not a remedy - we are an empty shell. The manufacturer of paper, which makes 10 million tons per year, poses a great threat?
Nosik: in our country two teams of paranoid collided. One side of the Kremlin wall, the other - according to this. On the other side they are sitting and afraid that someone will mate the “orange revolution”, on this side they always think that Putin is listening to their phone. He has nothing more to do. In the 99th, when Putin was still the Prime Minister, there were two opinions. One, relatively speaking, power, another, relatively speaking, liberal. Power: now the Internet is young, it contains only 70 thousand domains, we will all give them to state registration, we will be able to register all sites as the media and we will control who open the sites and who goes to them. And there was another opinion: there is no need to control anything, because, firstly, you can’t control, and secondly, people do not go on the Internet, no one can take anyone out of the Internet. And if we do not control this, we can always present to the world that we have democracy.
Why then do the Chinese do this?
Nosik: List the G8 members to me. Is there China there - in the "Big Eight"?
Artamonova: Each country chooses its own path. Some countries do not let their citizens abroad. We release.
You both agreed that the Russian government understands that the Internet is a free platform ...
Nosik: She understood it 10 years ago.
... and she can’t do anything about it?
Nosik: maybe. All our “thick” channels with which people are connected to the Internet belong to the state (Rostelecom, Transtelcom, Electroelecom), or sit under twelve licenses, and each feedback turns them into illegal entrepreneurs. Making a Chinese model technically is a matter of one minute. Write an order of the Ministry of Communications - from today, access to the New Times, Mail.ru and BFM website. ru in the Russian Federation is not to be carried out. The disposal of the Ministry of Communications is mandatory to execute all operators. Vhesi Zlosibirsk is FSB in the Novosibirsk Region - rare intellectuals, which, in private through the courts, achieved from four Novosibirsk operators of blocking several foreign sites. Of course, all these locks do not work. Go to the proxy - and see what you want.
Artamonova: The Internet is, in general, a technical environment. And completely different things can exist in it. You perceive everything as a media site - for the opposition, for the authorities. And we are engaged in business. It is even difficult for you to understand how not we are not wealthy. We have an online store, we have sites about real estate, we have social networks, where people find their classmates, are friends with each other, photos from their vacation are “postponed”.
Are you equally ready to provide an advertising platform for both United Russia and for another Russia?
Artamonova: In principle, yes.
Their monopolists
Now 250 million people around the world are included in various social networks. Where does this desire to communicate through the Internet come from?
Artamonova: This is convenient. Once the technical elite began to use the Internet. Now-everyone who has at least some education and prosperity to buy a computer. All people who do not dig ditches on the street do not sit at the metro box office, but are connected at the workplace to the network, have the opportunity to use the Internet.
Nosik: Remember the “Office Roman”, the heroine of Akhedzhakova, who did not take the telephone phone from the ear? Well, now she has "classmates."
Users - cities mainly?
Artamonova: Yes, of course. There are a lot behind the Urals - Novosibirsk, Vladivostok. Plus, there are such enclaves like Norilsk, where there is a lot of money and there is nothing to do at all, it is very cold. The communication channels built good ones. But ahead, of course, the millionaire cities. And every city has its own monopolist.
Nosik: the so -called SDC - a network of documentary power. An authorized telephone monopolist as MGTS in Moscow.
Artamonova: In many large cities, intracity traffic is cheaper or free, and access to other regions to Moscow, abroad - more expensive and sometimes worse. Here you have connected in Yekaterinburg to any provider, he tells you: if you want to go to E1, for example, go for free or for 3 rubles, and if you want on mail.ru, pay for the run of traffic.
Nosik: “Medved” came with a 20-year delay. He has big plans, he wants to connect all the schools. Do you think Medved wants to depend on raw materials? He wants to live in a modern country. You will laugh - but Putin was born in a city that considers himself Europe, he also wants it.
Internet as evidence
Where then is this the desire of legislators and prosecutors to limit freedom on the network?
Nosik: Our liberal press is Alarmist. Here is Ivan Sydoruk, Deputy Prosecutor General, once every 6 months, it comes out with a statement that the Internet must be prohibited. The statement of the Prosecutor General that the opinion of the sidoruk is the personal problem of the Sydoruk’s wife and does not reflect the position of the General Prosecutor's Office, is not taken into account. Putin did not sign a single order, not a single law, not a single small piece of paper limiting our freedoms with Anya At actions. How difficult it is for us to have a federal opposition television channel, it is also easy to have an opposition site. The Internet is presented as evidence that we have freedom of speech. And there is something to present - in the post -Soviet space it is the most free. We have 19 sites prohibited on the federal list - extremist. And Yandex indexed three and a half million sites! We have three things against bloggers. Internet Research at MIT, 2004, a survey of bloggers and active network users: 30% reported that they themselves or their acquaintances had problems with the authorities or at the workplace due to something that they wrote on their blog. We had these problems from 6 million bloggers ...
Money from the air
How will business on the Internet develop?
Nosik: It will be like now. Nothing qualitatively has changed over the past 10 years.
Artamonova: Some time ago, the main source of income of Internet projects was media advertising. Then there was a contextual advertising that started with search engines, and now it is common on all sites on the Internet. The system analyzes what you are looking for in the search engine, and then shows you on other pages advertisements, taking into account your requests. The context has become a new method of earning for Internet sites that have brought the new category of advertisers on the Internet - small companies focused on processing already formed demand. In addition to advertising, there is also a separate direction - e -commerce. These are online stores and their derivatives. For example, often large portals create trading platforms on which the price lists of 200 most popular online stores (the so-called aggregators) are collected-your choice is expanding, and the portal receives a percentage from the store for your transition to it. Recently, Internet projects have earned well on users. At the dawn of the Internet there were attempts to take money from users for a fully paid service, but they failed. And 7 years have passed, while we learned how to make money on users correctly. The main model that now works in Russia is when the main service is free (for example, a social network), and the user pays there for the opportunity to somehow allocate himself, show, show off, put on a virtual golden crown .......
Nosik: for example, in a dating service, where millions of users are hanging in a prominent place. Dollar per minute.
Artamonova: You can raise your photo for the money to the main page, show it to everyone. In games we sell different “candy wrappers”. You play virtual billiards - you can buy yourself cigars. And everyone sees that you play for a reason, but sit, for example, at the card table with cigars or with a glass of whiskey. People like to stand out.
Will any high-quality jump occur?
Nosik: people are the same. You give them new technical capabilities - they want to communicate in the same way, buy cheaper, sell it more expensive, find a job, stand out, show off, and self -explode. Paradox: Computerization reduces and accelerates many processes a thousand times, a person from Vladivostok does not go to Moscow to read a book in the library, he receives it in a file for a second - and performance does not increase a thousand times.
When the first social networks were created, the idea was that people want to communicate ...
Nosik: This is a myth. Everything that became fashionable (in the 99th-portals, in 2005-blogs, in 2006-social networks), existed ten years before in the same form, simply the press did not call it such a word.
And what will be fashionable in 2010?
Artamonova: Questions from the series: I would have known a bonus, I would live in Sochi ... I do not quite agree with Anton. Of course, there are things that change human behavior. The possibility of making a blog appeared a long time ago, but this trend really became mass when the bloghostings appeared, free services available to anyone. Of course, earlier users somehow communicated via the Internet, but with the advent of the opportunity it is convenient and quickly added to any user “as a friend” and to stay with him always in touch in many respects social communications have changed, reached a new level. If we talk about trends, then in the technological sense, of course, wireless Internet will develop, which will give users the opportunity to be “always online”. It can also be noted that everything goes to the fact that we will switch from separate software applications to the web. That is, more and more our only tool will be a web browser. Another very interesting area is the development of cartographic services. For example, you can, if you want, broadcast your location on the map for proxies.
Nosik: I sit, say, in the bar, and the girls are sitting, they want to glue a man, I - them. And I show them with the help of a computer in my hand: here I am, here. Ready…
Anna Artamonova, 30 years old. Vice President, Director of PR and marketing of Mail.ru. She graduated from the Institute of Journalism and Literary Creativity.
Anton Nosik, 42 years old. Editor -in -chief bfm.ru. One of the founding fathers of the Russian media Internet. He launched such projects as Lenta.ru, Gazeta.ru, Vesti.ru, former head of the Sup of Blogs Service. More than 14 thousand users read his personal blog.
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1 raids - discs for storing large volumes of information.
