Alexander (Chacha) Ivanov: Protest concerts are the same as elections

How is punk different from politics? The viewer votes for him with a ruble, but does not want to vote for the deputy

It has always been believed that punk rock in general and punks in particular are pure protest, nihilism and anarchy, and that punks, these outcasts even among the most recent informals, are not able to articulate what they actually oppose. About "for"...

It has always been believed that punk rock in general and punks in particular are pure protest, nihilism and anarchy, and that punks, these outcasts even among the most recent informals, are not able to articulate what they actually oppose. It would seem ridiculous to talk about “for” in general. However, for example, the classics of the genre - Clash and Sex Pistols - had clear positions on political and social issues.

The leader of the Dead Kennedys, Jello Biafra, went furthest: in 1979, he ran for mayor of San Francisco and received an incredibly high fourth place for a heretic and a bully. Probably, punks are really not able to fit into the political system. If they could, they would immediately stop being punks. But they have an audience that musicians can influence more and longer than all political technologists put together.

"Naive", one of the oldest punk bands in our country today, is on vacation "due to creative differences." Her front-man, a man named Alexander Ivanov and nicknamed Chacha, this spring presented his new project called Radio Chacha.

The first album of the project is called Live Slow. Die Old ("Live slow, die old"), the fundamental rock and roll principle "Live fast, die young" turned inside out. Alexander Ivanov looks young, although you can’t reproach him for his love of sports and commitment to a healthy lifestyle, but the album is not youthful chatter and naked protest, but a completely constructive, not even too “bantering” look at society. On pop stars (“Elvis Presley of our days”), crazed officials (“Vasya-2”), stupid pseudo-informals (“Metalworker in Love”). On the authorities, on the people, who, however, also do not understand what they want. And are you ready to take responsibility for your actions? “... Rubbing bruises, / We will tell in the department, / That we had nothing in mind, / That we are satisfied with the regime, / That we live well, / And it was just an outburst of emotions” (“Posters”). One of Chacha's co-authors, Ivan (Noize MC) Alekseev, was imprisoned for ten days on July 31 of this year for critical verses about the police. How sincere and serious Ivanov is, and why a social trend is needed in rock music, I tried to find out.

- You said that the new project is "socially oriented". Are you serious?

- Certainly. There is a serious message and critical remarks about what is happening now.

Why are there so few of you, socially oriented people? Shevchuk, Borzykin, you are now ...

“And it’s all very unfashionable right now. The music industry is dependent on fashion. Nobody wants to be compared with Novodvorskaya! Society is cynical: a long period of glamor has just ended: petrodollars are flowing, we collect them, we party cool, we spend inadequately, we look cool and everything is in powders. The main trend figure was Ksenia Sobchak. All this can be defined - conditionally, approximately - as r&b ...

- Not real r&b, that is, rhythm and blues, but, as we now say, "rich and beautiful" - "rich and beautiful."

- Of course, such r&b of Russian bottling. As part of this trend, it was simply embarrassing to say some socially significant things. You would be ridiculed: who are you, you have nothing, you are a loser and envy everyone, and everything around is beautiful. But the trend is changing.

For myself, I feel the need to talk about what worries me. Solidarity with Yuri Yulianovich Shevchuk. On the "Chart Dozen" he talked about freedom in the country, about the cop state and all that. The speech made a strong impression on me, but the reaction of the organizers of the concert made an even greater impression. What happened to them! It costs a lot.

Did they panic?

Everyone was in a panic! Imagine: you are organizing an event with thousands of spectators, and then suddenly you have an artist who stops the song and criticizes the existing regime for ten minutes. Everyone is scared! Nobody wants to lose their position in the structure, a position that is very easy to lose in our country.

- Shevchuk turned out to be more radical than all the punks put together?

- Yes. At the same time, he is a poet who will fall into all anthologies.

How do poetry and music fit in with politics?

Well, first of all, we are rock musicians, and being a palace clown is not the job of a rock musician. Rock as a genre arose out of protest. Even Elvis Presley was perceived with hostility. Now it's hard to understand - well, a man sang melodic songs, what is it? It offended the way he did it: the white man sings like a black man! Scandal!

Rock cannot walk hand in hand with power. It is clear that in Russia everything depends on the authorities, but nevertheless.

- It is convenient for the leader of the Naiv group to think this way - you will not be invited to the Kremlin event, that is, you have no temptation.

- I can’t talk about the Naiv group now - it has been on a creative vacation for a year.

— Why, by the way?

- Here in the provinces, in the villages, people wear Naiva T-shirts. When I saw this for the first time, I realized that in twenty years the group had become something. I found my listener, and not flickering on the radio and on television, but from the basement. The group occupied a peculiar position in Russian show business: we performed a lot, we were a commercially profitable project, while we ran our own business, we didn’t even have an external management or a hired director! But at some point creative differences began.

Everyone has been playing for a long time, they have an unconditional right to their point of view. But the process of creating a song turned into torture for me personally. We argued over every harmony! They began to lean towards classic rock, more of this ... mid-tempo, comfortable music-making. The group has the right to develop. But I'm interested in punk rock and related genres now. So with my new project "Radio Chacha" - the temptation to speak to those in power, of course, has nowhere to come from: he will not be able to fit into the system. We do not live corporate parties and some special events, we are an ordinary group, we perform in the regions, in clubs. Come, buy a ticket and listen. But here, too, everything is not so simple. Look: people come to see me, and they pay money for it.

And would they go to the polls if they were asked to pay a hundred to two hundred rubles at the entrance to the polling station? Well, purely for the entrance? On the contrary, people are lured there in every possible way: come, we will sell you cheaper sausages here ...

- In your opinion, concerts can be compared with elections?

- Certainly. That is why the authorities have an interest in artists. It’s clear to me how many people “vote with their ruble” for me. And do the current politicians need them at all, or do they vote for them only out of desperation?

- "Naive" survived three political eras in the country ...

— Yes, the last years of the Soviet Union, perestroika, Yeltsin. We have always been critical of the authorities. The only thing: I was not critical of Putin when he came. When he began to collect the country and began to put things in order a little. From a historical point of view, I think there was a sense in his actions, and it was justified: to pull up, build up everyone, so that there would not be such a mess as under Boris Nikolayevich. Grandpa has already dismissed everyone! And after Yeltsin, this tightening of the screws was justified, but now it's no longer funny - now it's already scary.

The same can be said about the Moscow authorities. With all the shortcomings of Luzhkov, he put things in order. Under Gavriil Popov it was much worse. I was an adult, I remember everything: dirt, darkness, broken roads... In a democratic society there is a rotation of power. Without rotation, people sit in their places for decades and serve the interests of their families.

- Muscovites have repeatedly voted for Luzhkov because "the new one will steal, but this one already has everything." Is the person in power supposed to steal by default?

- Certainly. This is the national idea. If you think about it: what unites a nation? Theft! This cause unites all people at all levels. Everyone in Russia thinks stealing is cool. If you are a janitor and are able to steal a broom from another janitor, then you are done. The same fellows and the minister, distributing financial flows into his pocket, and the governor, sawing the budget of the region. This is one of the few ideas that unites all Russians. And the government is in a difficult position. You don't envy her at all. The people are extremely weak-willed, not ready for anything.

But punk rock can't make people ready, can it?

- I'm not saying that it is punk rock that can do this, although why not ... In order for the people to be ready for changes, it is necessary that the most active artistic and political groups shake them up in some way. It is precisely the authorities that do not allow them to stir up the people: any attempts to raise socially significant things for informal discussion - protest marches, demonstrations - are severely suppressed. The government doesn't let me say anything.

The authorities, if they really think about the future of the country and the public good, should give protest groups the opportunity to express their point of view - only this can help society get out of a state of deep apathy.