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here The main provisions of the discussion of the organizing committee on December 24 are published

Transcript of the first open meeting of the organizing committee of the rally on December 24

BORIS NEMTSOV: For now, an organizational proposal. We still have a quorum. So, the first proposal is to hold the event, our meeting, in an hour and a half, and thus end at 12:30. The second proposal is to invite Parkhomenko to hold this very meeting of ours.

SERGEY PARKHOMENKO: A great specialist in editorial meetings. Let's assume that we have a flyer here.

B. NEMTSOV: Yes. Keep in mind that the next time there is an organizing committee, someone else will lead it.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Okay. Yes. So, let's consider our first meeting of the organizing committee of the rally on December 24 open. The composition was determined yesterday through correspondence, calls and mutual agreements. Unfortunately, there have been some changes in him, first of all Yura Saprykin, our colleague ended up in the hospital yesterday with something like a cerebrovascular accident. It seems like nothing particularly serious, God willing everything will be okay, in 3 days he will join us. But today, unfortunately, he will not be there. Lena Lukyanova is, as I understand, somewhere far to the north near Khodorkovsky, in Karelia.

B. NEMTSOV: Yes, I talked to her yesterday. She said that she was with Mikhail Borisovich, but she, naturally, would take part in the organizing committee when she returned.

S. PARKHOMENKO: And Nastya Udaltsova, who represented the founders and asked, as I understand it, Ilya Ponomarev to be here instead. Well, she asked - she asked. Happens. Fine. So, Boris Nemtsov is participating in the meeting, Vladimir Ryzhkov is participating in the meeting, my name is Sergey Parkhomenko. Leonid Parfenov, Grigory Chkhartishvili, Ilya Ponomarev and somewhere along the long, long staircase Gennady Gudkov is climbing - I think that any minute he will also be here. That, in fact, is our whole...

B. NEMTSOV: Another honorable addition.

S. PARKHOMENKO: I also put another empty chair so that it could stand... Can I have that chair? Be kind. It seems that no one needs him - let's also put him symbolically on the table. And, if possible, print us a sign of Alexei Navalny. Alexey Navalny sits invisibly with us on this chair. Please leave this Navalny chair. Not here please. Be kind.

We specifically discussed this in detail yesterday. I would like to remind everyone that the organizing committee is a small compact body, next to it there is the so-called executive committee - I just remind those who did not directly participate in these... Please, I can ask you to sit among the journalists, moving away from the table so that you do not look like a member of this organizing committee. Thank you. I'm glad you don't pretend.

So now. Next to us there is an executive committee, in which quite a significant number of people have gathered who will be directly involved in various practical problems of organizing this meeting. We also agreed that the work of the organizing committee (and this is how it differs from the executive committee, first of all) is organized absolutely publicly. We will try to organize all our events, as simple as possible (well, here we need the help of my colleagues, journalists - we cannot do without them) ... Here is Gennady Gudkov. Gennady, please come here - this is your place. Organize in a completely open manner. I started with a request to my friends from the “Big City”, they have a good Internet channel here. Yes, Navalny’s sign appeared. They have a good Internet channel here, and we will be able to directly organize a broadcast of our conversation today on the Internet. I think that our next meeting will be held with the assistance of the Ekho Moskvy radio station; we already have an agreement with it. This is one of the questions that we need to clarify today, when exactly this meeting will take place. But just looking ahead, there is an agreement that the next meeting will take place not only on a live Internet broadcast, but also on a live radio broadcast with the opportunity (well, Ekho Moskvy listeners know this) with the opportunity to vote, ask questions, etc. , etc., etc. Let’s try to organize the work of our organizing committee in this way.

So, I have in my hands the first thing, it seems to me that everyone here at the table should have, these are the demands of the rally on December 10, which were adopted, if you remember, at the end of this event. Let me give everyone a piece of paper. Grisha, you too. Boris, Volodya. Everyone, it seems, is endowed with this list. It seems to me that the first question that we will have to discuss today is the question of what is our attitude towards these demands and what are our assumptions... Nastya Udaltsova has arrived, we need to somehow... How? Which one of you two is here? Should we leave Ilya Ponomarev? Fine.

B. NEMTSOV: No, well, at least let her go inside here and sit down somewhere, huh?

S. PARKHOMENKO: No, no. Please. No, we agreed that this number of people would be participants. Nastya, if you want to sit among the journalists, please come and sit down. True, this is not very comfortable - you have to sit on the floor. Well, now everything is in order.

This means that we have to define, or at least pose a question. I will tell you frankly, I do not expect that most of the issues will be resolved today - God forbid that we somehow put them before ourselves and make sure that they exist, but raise the question of what are our assumptions regarding these requirements and how do we assume act further depending on one or another attitude of the authorities towards them. This is one group of problems.

The second group of problems is, in fact, organizational problems and the distribution of responsibilities between us. We are all full of impressions and memories of the rally on the 10th, but it is quite obvious that there were several very clear problems, several ambiguities, several inaccuracies, in particular, technical problems somehow made themselves felt very much. Undoubtedly, our task is to ensure that this does not happen again. By the way, I want to remind everyone that, as I understand, we do not have an answer from the mayor’s office, the time has not come yet, yesterday at about 8 am the application was submitted. The formal period is what, 3 days, right? 72 hours. Well, it hasn't expired yet, which means we're waiting for an answer, and we hope that the answer will be reasonable, constructive and understandable. Let me remind you that there are 3 options regarding the location listed sequentially. The most preferable is Vasilievsky Spusk, the second is Manezhnaya Square and the third is Sakharov Avenue, that part of it that is on the outer side of the Garden Ring, between Samotechnaya Street and, well, actually three train stations. As I understand it, we are somehow still ready in one thing... It is known that the stated 50 thousand people fit into each of these three places. But as I understand, we are counting on a slightly larger number of people at this rally, and the experience of the previous rally allows us to hope for this. Here.

ILYA PONOMAREV: In general, in principle, I want to announce our agenda today before we start asking questions.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Please. I started doing this. Yes, microphone please. I started doing this. In my opinion, the first group of issues that should be discussed are the requirements of December 10, the second are various kinds of organizational requirements. Come on, we don't have any hierarchy here after all. If you have suggestions for this agenda, go ahead, take the microphone and, in fact, we are having a conversation here, a live conversation, and not a protocol meeting.

I. PONOMAREV: Well, I just think that we need to clearly state the points that we are discussing today. If we want to discuss a political issue, that's always probably a good thing. But it seems to me that, given the fact that there is a public broadcast and quite a bit of time, we need to discuss the most important question that everyone asks all the time, why we have gathered here in this particular composition, how competent this organizing committee is, accordingly, how it is formed and what, exactly, he should do. It seems to me that these are the most important questions.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Come on, ask a question, answer.

G. CHARTISHVILI: Let each of us very briefly say for one minute why, in his opinion, we have gathered here today, right? And then we will gather some kind of consensus on this matter. This means, from my point of view, we must, before solving technical issues, decide what is the spirit and style of the movement that brought us here - this is the most important thing, this is the first thing. Secondly, in my opinion, today we must each of us define our position, say what we think, and not decide anything, but give the opportunity to the people who hear us now and who will hear us later, to say which of these positions they support so that during our next meeting, having carried out monitoring, we already understand, so to speak, which points of view are worthy of further development and discussion.

LEONID PARFENOV: I think that we need to quickly move from our semi-amateur meeting to something organizational, normal, which would be engaged on a professional basis in creating something like an association of Moscow voters, which would enter into dialogue with the deputies of the current Duma, since everything Let's just say that the opposition parties, not the parties in power, all received an increase in their usual votes at the expense of voters who, rather, are not voters of their parties, but protesters against the party in power. Of course, it’s bad when such agreements are concluded retroactively, but it’s better, nevertheless, to talk and discuss, and formulate the demands that this, relatively speaking, association of Moscow voters has, which, obviously, also needs to be created somehow, Well, at least online registration or something like that. After all, no one forbids the creation of public organizations.

The point is one thing. It is clear that no one has accomplished anything with this election cycle, which is now ending, the sentiments have matured too late, have been dormant for a long time, and now we need to try so that these 5 years, and 6 years of the presidential mandate, do not go in vain. Of course, continuing some work related to challenging the results in general and in specific areas in particular. This is, in fact, what I think needs to be done.

GENNADY GUDKOV: Colleagues, I think that we need to divide today’s decisions, resolutions, or intentions into two parts. Firstly, regarding the rally, it is necessary to clearly unite everyone, all those who want fair elections. And the task of this rally movement should be absolutely clear only one thing - the creation in Russia of normal political legislation, a normal electoral process, which will be free from administrative interference, manipulation, falsification and what we encountered with you on the night of the 4th to 5th -th December. This can and should be the demand of absolutely all political parties, regardless of their views and programs; it must be the demand of all civil society, all healthy social forces in Russia. Therefore, here we can unite on a fairly broad front.

And second, as practice shows, only unifying actions of the opposition, both systemic and non-systemic, produce results. I would propose (Vladimir Aleksandrovich Ryzhkov and I have already talked in advance) to create a permanent forum, well, with a conventional name, say, “United Opposition,” a permanent platform for interaction. Maybe there is some kind of small apparatus to be made there, an executive committee of 1-2 people. And, indeed, at this permanent forum we discuss not only the preparation of rallies, but in general the current political situation, current moments and current political events in order to evaluate them and put pressure on the authorities accordingly, form a public point of view, make our way into the media and so on, to achieve some positive changes. I think this is how it should be. Today we are preparing a rally. And then, it seems to me, we need to go this way so that people see that the opposition in Russia, regardless of political views, is capable of unifying actions in order to achieve common conditions for everyone, those that should be the basic principles of the general political life of society . That's what I think.

VLADIMIR RYZHKOV: First of all, it seems to me that all 5 demands of the rally of December 10 should be left for the 24th. Because the point of any campaign, the point of any public pressure on the authorities is to put forward demands and achieve their fulfillment. If we remove these 5 demands, it turns out that this was a one-time event and we, it seems, changed our minds, or rather, not us, but those tens of thousands of people who came. Let me remind you that these 5 points, Novaya Gazeta kindly published the original in yesterday’s issue, 5 of these points, which were unanimously accepted by the square. First, the immediate release of all political prisoners. It is clear that by the 24th those who were arrested on the 5th and 6th will be released, but there is Khodorkovsky, there is Lebedev, there are a lot of other people on trumped-up cases. It seems to me that there is no need to refuse. And the second question is fundamental - the cancellation of the results of the rigged elections. Are we ready to give up this requirement? This is a serious political issue. I personally believe that we should not give up this demand, because it was the main nerve of the rally on Bolotnaya. People do not recognize the results of these elections, people do not recognize this State Duma as legitimate. By the way, on the 21st there will be another moment when “A Just Russia”, the LDPR, the Communist Party of the Russian Federation, they have a fork in the road: either they will sit in the Duma and recognize that “United Russia” has a majority, knowing full well that in fact “United Russia” Russia did not get a majority - they only got 31-35%. If they sit down and distribute committees and admit that United Russia has a majority, then these 3 parties will legitimize theft and falsification. I believe that the slogan of canceling the elections should be abandoned on the 24th.

The third point, Churov’s resignation and an investigation into his activities, an investigation into all facts of falsification. The whole country demands this. How can we talk seriously about the presidential elections that Churov will organize? What faith can there be in these elections if Churov organizes them? They are illegitimate in advance for this reason alone, not to mention all the others.

The fourth demand of the rally is registration of opposition parties, adoption of democratic legislation on parties and elections. This Duma could have done this too, if A Just Russia, the Communist Party of the Russian Federation and the Liberal Democratic Party had brought down the majority of United Russia. And you have such an opportunity. Do not register on the 21st, demand a review of the results. And then you yourself will take committees, you will have a majority and you will pass any laws that you promised. Here is the fundamental fork in the road.

And the fifth demand of the rally is the holding of new open and fair elections. Do we have the moral right to refuse this demand if it was supported by the entire area? Therefore, it seems to me that we need to put 5 of these demands of the rally on Bolotnaya, maybe think about the 6th. I’ll say right away that I think we discussed this yesterday, that we can add a 6th demand under the conventional slogan “We won’t let Putin into the Kremlin,” because his reaction and Medvedev’s reaction was insulting to the rally participants, that we don’t listen, we we will not comply with these demands, we consider them incorrect, and so on. That is why I have such proposals to leave the same demands on the 24th, try to bring out even more people than on the 10th, and thereby put sufficient pressure on the authorities so that they meet the people halfway.

B. NEMTSOV: Good afternoon. Well, you probably know the reaction of both Putin and Medvedev to the demands of the rally. In my opinion, Medvedev’s reaction is simply insulting and, moreover, I would say, kind of stupid, because he said that he does not support the goals of the rally or the resolution. Let me remind you that the purpose of the rally was “for fair elections.” Well, he probably said the truth that he doesn’t like fair elections and is against it, but nevertheless, for voters who were deceived and more than 13 million votes were stolen from them, you must agree, this is, of course, a slap in the face. As for Putin’s reaction, he himself did not speak out, and his press secretary told Western agencies that everything was honest, which is a hundred percent lie, ordinary, however, and which was noticed by everyone. I have a hypothesis that by December 24, when we are supposed to hold a rally, they will not fulfill a single demand of our rally, that is, Churov will remain in place, and there will be no revision of the election results, including in Moscow, the Duma will begin its work Having happily divided their portfolios, the deputies who were indignant, including those present here, will be forced to continue working, although the Duma is obviously illegal. And in the end everything will move on.

Why do I think this? Because Putin believes (this is his character) that if he meets citizens halfway, even their legitimate demands, then he is demonstrating weakness. Although it seems to me that this is where you can demonstrate your intelligence and, I would say, regain at least the remnants of your reputation.

I agree with Vladimir Ryzhkov that we do not have the right to forget about those demands that they blatantly do not fulfill. We simply don't have the right. We will lose a huge number of supporters. And besides, you need to understand that at the rally on Bolotnaya there were many observers who personally recorded these same violations, and now alone, and sometimes together with parties, they are trying to protest these same violations in court. And if we now say, “Oh, wait, okay, they didn’t listen to us, let’s put forward some other demands now,” I’m afraid that trust in us will simply disappear instantly.

Now regarding Leonid Parfenov’s proposal, and as I understand it, this is a joint proposal with Grigory. No? I think Leonid's proposal is very interesting. Very interesting. As I understand it, this is a Moscow association of voters, right, Leonid?

L. PARFENOV: Well, or something like that. In general, it doesn’t matter what it was called, you know? Because we have to count first. We don’t understand how many people voted, say, for “A Just Russia” under duress – not because they are Just Russia members, but because... And so on. There are plenty more. There are people who did not vote at all, finding it impossible... You just need to count the number of people who are dissatisfied with these elections and would like to further change the electoral system and so on, at least in Moscow. Well, offer this form to other regions.

B. NEMTSOV: I simply support what Leonid said. I think this is a great idea. It should be included, in fact, in the resolution on the 24th, and this, indeed, will make the work absolutely meaningful. So? Now the last thing. I believe that our activists, the people who come to the rally, will ask us the following question: “Friends, okay, well, they ignored you. They collected your demands in one place, as Viktor Stepanovich Chernomyrdin said, and forgot, right? What are you going to do next?” I have very specific proposals. The authorities are, of course, concerned about March 4th, that is, concerned about this special operation, which they call “presidential elections.” It seems to me that we need to continue the pressure, and peacefully, calmly, without hysterics, but continue the pressure so that our absolutely legitimate demands are satisfied. As the main slogan “We won’t let Putin into the Kremlin,” what Vladimir said is very correct, and we could formulate a completely pre-election thesis with the following content: “Not a single vote for Vladimir Putin.” But the slogan “Not a single vote for Vladimir Putin,” in my opinion, in addition to the fact that it is absolutely clear, it also preserves the unity of the opposition. The fact is that before the parliamentary elections the opposition discussed how to behave. Often this discussion was overflowing, with elements of hysteria. It seems to me that now we cannot afford such a luxury, because one of the fundamental results of the rally is that we managed both systemic, registered and non-systemic parties, and most importantly, people absolutely far from politics, to be together and absolutely calmly look into each other's eyes and understand each other. It seems to me that this is unity, this agreement...

I. PONOMAREV: We agreed to talk for one or two minutes now.

S. PARKHOMENKO: I think it’s clear. It seems to me that, in fact, there are two completely distinct positions; it is absolutely not a fact that they contradict each other, but they are nevertheless expressed next to each other. From what has already been said. Your position has not yet been expressed - now you will express it. So, one story is these requirements. Another story is what Grigory Chkhartishvili spoke about over the past days and what he, in fact, spoke about at the last rally, that is, Moscow. I think that we need to give Grisha the opportunity to somehow argue his point of view, why he means that this is more important than others, and how this relates to the story about these 4 or 5 theses.

G. CHARTISHVILI: You know, let me start with something even more important, with what I mentioned. About what, strictly speaking, is the movement that we all saw and which, to be honest, I don’t really understand, I don’t know whether you fully understand it. I can only share my impression of what united, in my opinion, the people who gathered on Bolotnaya Square. I would build on this. I would now rely only on what unites us all, and not on what separates us. I noticed 3, so to speak, moments there, 3 pillars on which I would build our entire movement now.

The first one is called "Goodwill". There was a very pleasant, unusually friendly atmosphere at this meeting. I propose to take this as the first principle of our activities. We are all different, we all have different points of view. I suggest that we all treat each other with respect and kindness, even when we disagree with each other, and let this generally be the spirit and style of our movement.

Secondly, this is openness. It is they, our opponents, who make decisions behind closed doors, decide who their successor is and who is not their successor, they calculate in advance which party will take how many elections in parliament, and they only tell us the results. I have no doubt that our first meeting today will be crumpled, awkward, amateurish. But I don’t see this as our weakness - in my opinion, this is our strength. We're talking in front of everyone here, right? This, in my opinion, in my opinion, has never happened before. And I would hold on to that. Therefore, I suggest that we now not argue among ourselves, but simply indicate to everyone our point of view and see how people respond. By the next meeting we will have more clarity.

And finally, the third principle, which... I don’t know, maybe you won’t agree with me, but I have the feeling that the people who gathered in the square were not a politicized collection of people. These were people whose self-esteem was offended, their ethical and aesthetic sense was offended. Therefore, I would like to urge all of you, both at the rally and during this entire movement, not to propagate your parties.

So, Grigory Yavlinsky spoke at the rally, right? I don’t know, it seemed to me that many were offended by his speech, because it looked like the beginning of his personal presidential campaign, there, “Yabloko” and so on. It’s the same as if, I don’t know, Sergei Parkhomenko would come out on stage and start saying, “And at the same time, subscribe to the Around the World magazine.” Or Bykov and I would go out and say: “And at the same time, buy our books.” Let us not have partisanship, because it divides people.

Now about Moscow, not Moscow. Do you see what's the matter? Of course, I want elections in our country to be canceled and new parties to be registered. But I have the feeling (maybe I’m wrong) that this mood is only in Moscow for now, that the country is still looking at us. If the country supports us, then this movement should expand throughout the country. St. Petersburg, excellent. Therefore, I would now talk about re-elections in Moscow, where, I have a feeling, there is a majority in our country. Peter will pick it up - great. But I wouldn’t take aim at the whole country now, I don’t feel that way.

One more thing. For us now, in my opinion, the main thing is that the new rally does not cut off the people who came to the previous one, but brings new people there. This means that the time remaining before the rally is not a pause, but this is the time through which you need to score points. I would... I really liked Leonid Parfenov's proposal to create a Moscow association. This is what I think (suggestion). What if this rally was not just a place where people came to freeze, listen to speakers who could not be heard and disperse, that if some kind of action was held there, for example, the registration of the Moscow association of voters would be held there, and people would come and sign there with a passport and so on, will this be an action, and not just something?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Please, who's next?

I. PONOMAREV: Still, I wanted to say something about what I was talking about initially, about the organizing committee and why we have gathered here. Because here I am, too, now sitting the same way, on Twitter, everyone is asking the same question: “Why this composition and not another?” Because I absolutely agree with Gregory. The people who gathered in the square were completely apolitical, with the exception of maybe a couple of thousand people there. Some came to Solidarity, others came to the Left Front. The overwhelming majority were apolitical.

B. NEMTSOV: Can I answer this?

I. PONOMAREV: The demand was simple - re-elections, indeed. For example, I also don’t understand why we are talking about how we can somehow revise the requirements, right? These demands, for which the entire area voted, they, indeed, absolutely unite us all in this sense. I don’t think anyone should... We don’t even have the right to raise the question of somehow changing, adding, or rewriting these requirements.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Does anyone really ask this question?

I. PONOMAREV: I say no, since two speakers spoke about this, then we, accordingly, must...

S. PARKHOMENKO: That's not what they were talking about.

I. PONOMAREV: Well, they said that we should leave them unchanged. I say that, in principle, we cannot ask such a question, right? Just in relation to everyone else who is sitting at this table and your humble servant, and Gennady, and Vladimir, and Boris. There is someone online who says, “Why these?” But, in my opinion, no one says about Leonid and Gregory, “Why these?” Therefore, I believe that this position is consolidated by the “Left Front”, that our such meetings... Even the fact that this broadcast is a broadcast. All the same, we, as it were, took upon ourselves the process of making decisions of some kind, organizational, technical, and especially ideological. I believe that such meetings should be open in terms of participation. Today, such a spontaneous get-together is gathering at 7 o’clock in the evening in Domzhur, to which about 100 people are going to come from a variety of people, and Chirikova, Kashin, and Mitrokhin are going to be there, that is, everyone who participated in the rally, and who did not participate in the rally. There is a global platform, tested regarding how mass civil actions take place, called the “Charter of Social Forums”, which, on the one hand, limits political representation very significantly, that is, it prohibits political parties from dominating on this platform - you can only take part as individuals. On the other hand, which establishes open principles for making all decisions, whoever comes has the opportunity to become members of the organizing committee. Therefore, I believe that we need... The more such platforms there are, the better it is, because the better everyone’s positions are visible there, we can discuss. But we cannot make decisions regarding how this rally will be organized. We must gather in an open area. there to form working groups in specific areas, someone will be there to create a union, right?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes, I understand. Let's give an answer. You asked a question, Boris answered it.

I. PONOMAREV: Then, accordingly, it will be democratic.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Thank you. Let's not delay. Boris.

B. NEMTSOV: So Ilya has already asked the same question twice, I will answer. We proceeded from the following. We proceeded from the question: who, in fact, was the organizer of the rally on Bolotnaya? And we... No, wait a second. Well, this is demagoguery, but there is simply... People came to the rally, thank God, and with great enthusiasm and hope. And the organizers were very specific people. These people were both representatives of civil activists and opposition movements, and completely non-partisan citizens. By the way, the vast majority of those at the rally turned out to be. My estimate is that at the rally there were about 10%, indeed, oppositionists and activists, and 90% were people who had never gone to rallies in general and, perhaps, came to it for the first time.

Together with Sergei Parkhomenko, we proceeded from the fact that the organizers of the organizing committee of the rally on the 24th on Vasilyevsky Spusk should be people who contributed to the rally on Bolotnaya, the largest in the last 20 years. That's what we started from. This is the first one.

Secondly, we believed and still believe that representatives of those organizations that participated in the preparation of the rally on Bolotnaya should be in the singular when talking about organizations. That is why Nastya Udaltsova represented the “Left Front”. You know that the Left Front, together with Solidarity, were the applicants for the rally at Chistye Prudy - she was simply late, so she should have been sitting in your place. Second, I represent Solidarity, Volodya Ryzhkov, who led the rally, represents the People’s Freedom Party.

On the part of civil activists, let’s say, not even activists, but simply concerned citizens, there are respected people here... Yes, and Gudkov, of course, “A Just Russia” - you know, “A Just Russia” played an active role in this rally and many spoke from her.

As for representatives of citizens, they are also present here - this is Parkhomenko, this is Parfenov and Grigory, right? That's why they are here, there's probably no need to explain. Specifically, if we talk about Gregory, the citizens liked his performance the most. Moreover, not only those who were at the rally (it’s difficult to assess this), but there was a vote, as far as I understand, on the Internet.

S. PARKHOMENKO: This is Lenya, indeed, yesterday there was a vote on the Internet, the question was asked who you would like to see speak at the next rally. And Lenya defeated everyone by a huge margin, including Navalny, for example, which was a surprise for us.

L. PARFENOV: Boris, what are we talking about? What kind of legitimacy are we talking about now? Why do we have to prove anything? Why is this?

B. NEMTSOV: Well, he asks.

L. PARFENOV: I don’t understand why this question is asked.

B. NEMTSOV: I don’t understand either, but it exists.

L. PARFENOV: We’ve already sat down, we’re already talking. Let us quickly talk about the content and not make excuses for no apparent reason.

B. NEMTSOV: Laziness, we’ll finish now, so that it’s clear to the people who are sitting and watching us where this composition comes from.

L. PARFENOV: Well, we’ve already been sitting, why argue now, huh? Well?

B. NEMTSOV: In short...

S. PARKHOMENKO: There is a living person, Ilya Ponomarev, who believes that it is necessary to argue on this topic. He wants an answer. Let's give him the answer.

I. PONOMAREV: Well, okay, let those who listen to us give the answer.

G. GUDKOV: In order not to sit idle, let me give a conciliatory answer. Who cares how many people want to support the rally? The bigger, the better. Here, another group of comrades will gather at 7 o’clock - let’s involve them, let’s invite them. We have nothing to share. It is necessary to divide when the conditions are created, when the conditions are created for elections, for the creation and development of political parties, for the formation of these governments through mechanisms, and so on, and so on. Let's first create these conditions, and then we will share there. It seems to me that now the more the merrier. We really need to do something... Let this organizing committee be today, then it will expand, we will invite Yabloko with Mitrokhin, we will invite whoever else will be there. Today the task is to consolidate the healthy forces of society.

S. PARKHOMENKO: There is just one problem, that, starting at some point, it will become clear that we need to create a super-organizing committee for this organizing committee, which will actually deal with practical work. You understand perfectly.

G. GUDKOV: Well, Medvedev created a big government, we will create a big organizing committee.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Go ahead. So, people are currently putting forward this. These papers that are constantly being brought to me here are, in fact, a reaction to what is happening on the air right now. Yes, take it, there are several copies here. And what happened yesterday on FaceBook - there were quite a lot of visitors there, quite a lot of questions. I think we need to leave some time to talk about these topics because there are extremely valuable things here. And you immediately need to be aware of this. We are now in dire need of such, excuse me, offline activities. It is impossible to sit on FaceBook continuously. It is quite obvious that there are a huge number of people around us who send us messages in different ways, starting from our acquaintances who call on the phone, and ending with a huge number of strangers who write on the Internet, sending us one simple question: “What can I do for you?” to do all this?” So we certainly need, and I think what's going to happen tonight at 7 p.m. is just the first of a huge series of these kinds of events, we definitely need to bring together a lot of different direct physical meetings of people - we just need some kind of premises for that, this cannot be done in the open air, where people could gather and discuss their participation in the preparation of this rally offline, that is, off the Internet. What happens just on the street? A separate story, let's talk about that a little later. It seems to me that there is absolutely no doubt on this topic. Let's try to focus now on a very important proposal that has been made here and, in my opinion, an extremely powerful one, which is about registering people on the spot. And registration of this very association.

I. PONOMAREV: Well, is this technically possible?

S. PARKHOMENKO: I think it is technically possible. If you put this... Once again, I say, next to us there is what is called the “executive committee”. These are people, there are significantly more of them than there are of us here, these are our people, in fact, our friends and ours... We understand each other perfectly well. This means that this task needs to be set and, I think, a group will be formed that will deal with this in the same way as a group has already been formed that deals with light, sound, stage and everything else, it was headed by Yura Saprykin, who, unfortunately, is 3 days old We won’t have it here, but it’s okay – the work won’t stop. Such a group already exists. So, let’s, actually, the first thing we decided today is that we are creating a group of people that will provide the technical possibility of this very registration. This means that at this rally there should be some people standing, holding, I don’t know, some kind of printed forms in their hands, tables or on their knees, doing all this. Well, in general, let's figure out how to do it. In general, there must be some people who are involved in this. It's decided. Next, Grisha, right?

G. CHARTISHVILI: And besides this absolutely necessary thing... Parkhomenko, don’t get distracted. Putin and Medvedev don’t behave like that at a government meeting. This means that I think that we will need a large number of young volunteers, because, indeed, we need to move from the Internet to offline. Leaflets, there, here and there, fifth and tenth. I also think that this whole movement should be different from our opponents in that it should be creative, fun and, in general, so to speak, so that it would be great to be in it. This means that I think it will be necessary to involve creative people, and there are a lot of them around, so that they come up with all sorts of new forms. Including, well, now at least invite people to this rally, right? For example, I was very amused by some of the slogans that I saw at the rally; they were excellent. Maybe it makes sense to hold a competition for the best slogans, and I don’t know whether it is technically possible or not, to make them, so to speak, those that will win, to make them big.

I think that it will be necessary to launch videos with famous people who will call for this rally, we will need to come up with something else that would demonstrate, well, that Moscow is with us. It would also be possible to hold a competition for a name for this rally. Because “For fair elections” is, of course, wonderful, we are all for fair elections, but... Maybe we can come up with something more beautiful.

G. GUDKOV: If I may, I’ll say two words. I just want to continue Gregory’s thought about creativity. We just discussed before our meeting. Let's think about some emotional moment. Well, we now have the interesting political satire of the same Bykov, and today there are representatives of various musical styles. It seems to me that we now need to create some kind of emotional moment at the rally, because the rally is quite long, people change. Some spend an hour, some an hour and a half, some two. And, of course, this is a purely emotional moment that needs to be revived. Of course, it shouldn’t be some kind of Cossack hopak or something like that. It is clear that this should be consistent with the slogans and goals of the rally, but it seems to me that this needs to be done. And now I, too, thanks to Sergei, am reading here. The regions are online, they say that it is necessary to support such a movement in the regions, as was the case on December 10, to hold not only a rally in Moscow, but also in the regions. Why don’t we now, for example, call on those regions that wish to organize themselves to hold similar rallies on the same day? And the simultaneity of such actions has a very large psychological impact on the authorities. Invite regions to hold their own rallies. And I think that large cities, such as St. Petersburg, Yekaterinburg, Yaroslavl and so on, are capable of supporting this and holding serious rallies. This also affects the situation. Thank you.

- Can?

S. PARKHOMENKO: No, you can’t, no, you can’t.

- Why not? I am also a participant in the conversation.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Please. I beg you very much.

B. NEMTSOV: Colleagues. Colleagues.

- You are asking the wrong question. In this system there can be no leaderism and party work.

B. NEMTSOV: We already guessed.

- No. This is a network.

- This is not what the discussion is about.

- This is what the discussion is about. Excuse me, there are no leaders here, there are no leaders here. I represent an ordinary participant.

- Very good, I am also an ordinary participant, I was invited to visit. I came to visit the Big City.

G. GUDKOV: Well, your ideas are accepted. Let's not argue, guys.

- The idea is simple. Now a political force has entered the arena. There are no commanders here, there are no leaders here. The idea is as follows. Boris Nemtsov tells us “I want...” We delegate these rights.

- Again. You were invited to visit, right?

G. GUDKOV: Comrades, even in a family someone is in charge.

- “We will organize and we will manage the process.”

G. GUDKOV: You are blocking the space for the cameras.

B. NEMTSOV: Colleagues, everything is clear. Can I say two words? Look, it seems to me that the most important task, after all, is to make sure that as many people as possible come. And the more involved in this process, the greater the chances that there will be a lot of people. It would be cool if there were more people at the rally on Vasilyevsky than on Bolotnaya. It is very important. I think that the idea is to announce, for example, a competition... First of all, it’s a brilliant idea to have famous people appear in videos, and it would be a series of videos, there would be a lot of them - that’s very cool. You just need to make this list of people and talk to them. This is probably not an easy task. Well, including Shevchuk, right?

Secondly, it seems to me that we should immediately, perhaps after today’s meeting, announce a competition on the Internet for leaflets calling for people to come to the rally. Here's to the leaflets. Otherwise, we’ll be creative here for a long time and won’t come up with anything. I think the network will figure out what leaflets should be much faster. Then we could conduct a vote, also online, select the best and immediately print them - our function would be this - so that they could be distributed throughout Moscow, right? That is, not to draw here ourselves, but to do it.

Next, it seems to me very important to make a video, and it needs to be done immediately, a video, a radio video. Of course, they won’t give us television – that’s clear. But the radio spot is where famous people could record it. It is important. And finally, the last thing, I agree that the atmosphere should be friendly and so friendly. In this sense, the presence of not only public figures, politicians or non-politicians, matters, but the presence of musicians matters. Now, it seems to me that, for example, Shevchuk’s presence is an important matter. Although, I'm not sure he's the only one. Maybe there would be others too. Therefore, if Yura Shevchuk, we would now decide to invite him, it would be great. Perhaps there are some other people who need to be invited. Thank you.

V. RYZHKOV: Is it possible, Sergei?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes.

V. RYZHKOV: I would like... We, you know, have feedback and they printed out a request for us to raise the issue of the fate of Seryozha Udaltsov, who is now in serious condition in prison, he is sick. And I just want to inform you that as soon as we finish, I will contact the Moscow Human Rights Commissioner, the Council for the Rights of Detainees, and just make a call to the mayor’s office so that they urgently intervene in this situation. Nastya, well, we'll do it...

- They've already called.

V. RYZHKOV: Once again we will call all day today until we achieve a result. I promise that. Second, I will call, and Gennady will send a telegram, yes. And, Grigory, I want to say that, fortunately for all of us, it is not only Moscow that demands re-elections. On the 10th, I think, spontaneous actions took place in 20 cities, some of them quite massive. For example, yesterday Leonid Volkov from Yekaterinburg told us that in his city, apparently, the largest single picket in world history took place - 7 thousand people took part in it, in this single picket. Now, as I know, applications have been submitted in a huge number of regions to hold rallies on the 24th. And there is every reason to expect that the rally in Moscow on the 24th will be supported by hundreds of thousands of people across the country. Therefore, this is not only a Moscow issue - it is, in fact, a theme for the whole country.

I. PONOMAREV: I would like to develop my thoughts regarding musicians and so on. It seems to me that this rally in general, given that this is the last weekend before the New Year and, in fact, many are saying that we will have problems with turnout because of this, well, it seems to me that our weakness must be turned into our strength. Let's make it a full-fledged half-day festival, starting there with three hours...

V. RYZHKOV: There is an application for only 2 hours.

I. PONOMAREV: Well, an application, after all, we can talk about that. No, people will just come and go, make a full-fledged rally, a rally-concert.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Application for 4 hours - from two to six.

V. RYZHKOV: Okay.

I. PONOMAREV: Organize a full-fledged rally-concert, that is, a performance by a musical group, with 2-3 political performances.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Recorded. It's clear. Yes, and they are already doing this. Yes, yes, this work is already underway, it is undoubtedly part of the work there related to light, stage and other things. It is clear that we must immediately think about who is standing on this stage besides the actual speakers.

G. GUDKOV: Colleagues, I would like literally two points. An important issue will be security, the internal security of the rally participants, and I would like to suggest, perhaps, to think about some kind of public organizations that would take on the function of promptly responding to possible provocations. I'm afraid they'll try to provoke me.

- I will tell Gudkov.

G. GUDKOV: Well, we will entrust Gudkov, but I need mechanisms so that people react to provocations immediately, these people, limit their legal capacity, hand them over immediately to the police, so that our rally takes place absolutely as peacefully, clearly, and organized as the previous one . Well, deputy Gudkov Jr. writes me an SMS: “Propose a single ringtone for mobile phones or a melody instead of beeps. Well, for example, Tsoi’s song “Changes,” right? Why did I read it? Because I’m not very good at this, so I think it’s... Well, I know the song “Changes”, I can even play it, but I don’t know what a single ringtone is.

S. PARKHOMENKO: There is a technical detail here, but, in my opinion, quite important. Among the questions that come to us now from the Internet, they remind us of a very correct thing - that we need to finally come up with some kind of system with which to count the number of rally participants. It is clear how this should be done. Here we need to remember the experience of the beginning... Let's take it seriously. This means that there is, in fact, a well-known system, invented by the Reuters agency in Moscow in the early 90s. When we know the exact location, we will measure this place exactly in advance, put some kind of markers there, we will know the area of this or that part of this very, relatively speaking, Sakharov Avenue, and then we will firmly know by the amount of occupied space how many people there are. This is done very well.

V. RYZHKOV: For journalists, I want to tell you where the information comes from. The information came from the police. And when we called the numbers 120-130 from the stage, these were not our speculations - the police gave operational estimates during the rally. At first it was 40, then they said “60”, then a figure appeared of more than 100 thousand. And when we all read the next morning that there were 25 thousand, it was homerically funny, because this figure was officially given by the same police who had said “100-120-130 thousand” the day before.

S. PARKHOMENKO: In my opinion, we are involved in all kinds of technology. Grisha, come on.

G. CHARTISHVILI: Yes, I have a question regarding our, well, the next meeting of the organizing committee, which will be held... Do I understand correctly that it will be held under the Network Visor?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes, undoubtedly.

G. CHARTISHVILI: Is there an opportunity for people who are there to watch it, react and show whether they support this or that point of view?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes, I asked Echo of Moscow, which undertook to organize this. This will not be directly in the Echo of Moscow studio, it will be here nearby in one of the premises, but Echo of Moscow will help us organize this entire package of opportunities - both voting and this very cardiogram of the air.

G. CHARTISHVILI: Can you explain to those who are watching us how it works, so that they can understand?

S. PARKHOMENKO: It works extremely simply. There will be a video broadcast in this very Network Viewer, and there will also be 2 buttons. Once a minute you have the opportunity to click on the “I support” or “I do not support” button, depending on which you influence the construction of this graph. This is a very well-functioning system; it is already working on Ekho Moskvy.

G. CHARTISHVILI: And we will also be able to see how people react to this or that?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Let’s install a monitor and it will be visible. Why not?

G. GUDKOV: Colleagues, I would also like to ask an important question. Will we have some kind of official special invitation to the participants, or rather, to the political system parliamentary parties? Well, I don't mean A Just Russia (representative here). I mean the Communist Party of the Russian Federation, the Liberal Democratic Party, an invitation to a rally. Because as I understand it, at the previous rally there were no speakers from the leadership of these parties.

B. NEMTSOV: But there were invitations.

G. GUDKOV: Do we do it on purpose? Or are these just general invitations?

B. NEMTSOV: Look, that rally that took place on the 10th, it was truly unifying and there were representatives of almost all parties except one. So? No, I mean United Russia. Perhaps there were also representatives of Zhirinovsky’s party, but they were somehow shy and did not come to the podium. We, I think, probably shouldn’t send any personal invitations - we should say that this is a public rally. We invite everyone there. Do you want us to send a personal invitation to Zhirinovsky? I think this shouldn't be done. Zyuganov – I also think that it shouldn’t be done. For what?

G. CHARTISHVILI: I also think that there is no need to invite any parties.

B. NEMTSOV: Yes. They just want to come - let them come, there are no problems.

G. CHARTISHVILI: In the end, I read with interest that a group has formed within United Russia that wants to get rid of swindlers and thieves within the party. This means that not all swindlers and thieves are inside United Russia, let them come too.

B. NEMTSOV: That is, there will be nothing left of the party, in short. The party will turn into zero in the end.

I. PONOMAREV: I also think that there is no need to invite parties separately. Whoever wants comes in a physical capacity. After all, we are here in a physical capacity, right? But I think it’s very important not to forget about the white ribbons - here on the Internet they tell me about the movement of the white ribbon, because this is a very important visual symbol of the action. We need to promote this topic for these 2 weeks so that everyone will wear it. White shirts, white ribbons, red lining.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Accordingly, this is a collective answer to several similar questions that came here, and they all consist in the fact that “call such and such a movement, such and such a party, such and such a group, such and such a grouping.” Answer: “We call everyone and don’t call anyone at the same time.” What I mean is that there will be no personal invitation to anyone.

B. NEMTSOV: Parkhomenko, take back your words.

S. PARKHOMENKO: I take my words back.

B. NEMTSOV: We’re calling everyone. Dot.

S. PARKHOMENKO: I take this wording back. We invite everyone, but not in the form of personal invitations to this or that group or party.

G. CHARTISHVILI: One more thing I want to say. So that Alexei Navalny’s chair here is not an empty symbol, let us arrange it so that at our next meeting we receive what he would say if he were here, it was read, this opinion was heard. Fine?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Communication with him is quite complicated, but nevertheless.

B. NEMTSOV: In fact, yesterday I managed to contact them - it was not easy for me to do. But nevertheless, he said that he would participate in the meeting of the organizing committee live, of course - this will be, I hope, on the evening of the 21st, when the deadline ends. I think this is a reasonable thing. He can simply write here, and all suggestions will naturally be voiced.

Can you give me a short summary of what exactly we agreed on?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes, I think it is necessary to list some things that were said here.

B. NEMTSOV: Yes, and can I list what I wrote down?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes. I also wrote it down here.

B. NEMTSOV: Look, we agreed that at this rally, technically, tables should be organized to collect signatures for an appeal to create an association of voters - this is Parfenov’s proposal, so materialized. Secondly, we took note that videos will be made with the participation of famous citizens of our country, encouraging people to come to the rally. Third, as I understand it, no one objected to the competition for the best leaflet encouraging people to come to the rally.

V. RYZHKOV: Slogan, leaflet, poster.

B. NEMTSOV: Yes, a slogan, a leaflet, a poster, that’s right, Volodya. Fourth, no one objected to the fact that we made one personal invitation for Shevchuk. I don't think anyone objected to this.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Well, he will be among those famous who...

B. NEMTSOV: No, no, not just in videos, but invite you to a rally.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes, yes, undoubtedly. Yes Yes.

B. NEMTSOV: Because Ilya correctly said that this element of the festival should, of course, be in this matter.

S. PARKHOMENKO: A whole list will be compiled. We will assume that we have already filled out the first 2 lines in this list.

B. NEMTSOV: Let us record these decisions.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes, yes, yes, yes. Here they are recorded with me.

B. NEMTSOV: Who records them here?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Let me record it this time. Here they are... Yes, well, actually, it will be difficult to escape from this. Here I have it written down. Fine. There are people - this, in fact, is the advantage of this guts-out life, this public system.

So, look. Well, in the meantime, I'm looking through the questions that came to us. I think we have answered almost everything. There is a story about leaflets here, a story about videos here. Please pay attention to the proposal of the writer Akunin to create a coordination center for voters - this actually happened here. Take leaflets. “Someone from the Caucasian youth should speak at the rally.” Well, some of the Caucasian youth will come and offer to perform. And why, exactly?.. What is the problem?

B. NEMTSOV: No, there is one more technical question - about white ribbons. However, it is necessary to record that we continue to consider white ribbons as a symbol of our action.

S. PARKHOMENKO: From the Caucasian youth, yes, Grigory Chkhartishvili, excellent.

B. NEMTSOV: Seryozha, please write about the ribbons.

S. PARKHOMENKO: I wrote it down, yes. Ribbons. So, the last thing we have left is the next meeting, Friday.

B. NEMTSOV: Do you have time?

S. PARKHOMENKO: From three to five, we will have 2 hours.

B. NEMTSOV: Where?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Right here, nearby. We will announce. We'll notify everyone. Here, in one of the neighboring buildings, this broadcast will be organized using “Echo of Moscow” with the whole package of possibilities, with all the voting, cardiograms of the air and so on, so on, so on. Friday from three to five.

B. NEMTSOV: Excellent.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yes, one of the organizers wants to tell us something.

- ...

S. PARKHOMENKO: Please, we are still doing this, is the broadcast still working? How are you?

I. PONOMAREV: Yes, but can we just do the latter organizationally? Still, I once again invite everyone to come to this open area this evening. Volodya will be, as I understand it, Gennady. Now, if you come, Sergey. The bigger, the better.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Okay. Yes. You have already asked your question, thank you.

- I have an offer. Guys, are you really...

- You can't be heard without a microphone.

- Okay, I'll say it louder. Guys, you get caught up in the little things. Now, in general, the problem of elections is that it has already left. Now the guys will receive their mandates, we will go to court, as they say.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Your position is clear: we don’t need to worry about elections. Thanks for the interesting offer.

- An important topic of the rally is the presidential race. We must nominate a single candidate. Because now Prokhorov will split again and so on.

V. RYZHKOV: I'm afraid to disappoint you, legally the deadline for nomination expired yesterday, according to the law.

- Why?

V. RYZHKOV: Because the law.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Because that’s the law.

B. NEMTSOV: No, in fact, the situation is even worse. I inform you that December 9 was the deadline to notify the Central Election Commission of your desire to nominate yourself for president. Well, I understood myself. And only parties have the opportunity to nominate until December 20. Only parties. Therefore, independent...

- What about the A Just Russia party?

B. NEMTSOV: They have already nominated the wonderful Mironov. Already nominated.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Thank you. So let's...

L. PARFENOV: Can I make another proposal? It simply seems to us, after all, that in order for all this to quickly move on to some kind of professional basis, I mean uniting voters and leaders would be nominated whose publicity is explained by the fact that they are engaged in this public work, and not because they public professionals in their fields. We need to come to this as soon as possible. Therefore, our proposal, that is, not even a proposal, but a decision with Boris Akunin, that we will not participate in the next meeting, but let these 2 places of ours be taken by some other socio-cultural figures, because there... We are civil. ..

B. NEMTSOV: Yura will be there, as I understand it?

L. PARFENOV: Well, please... Yes.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Yura will be there in any case, of course.

L. PARFENOV: No, no, I mean Yura Saprykin. No, because we outlined our position there. They said what we offer. Well, we still won’t be able to work on this purely organizationally.

S. PARKHOMENKO: This is wrong.

L. PARFENOV: Well...

- Let’s not argue now, but listen to what people think.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Okay.

B. NEMTSOV: No, can we? We are people too.

- No, you are members of the organizing committee.

B. NEMTSOV: I understand. Gregory, I have a request. We've already talked, and it's good that you came. I think this is wrong. Well, that's wrong. You see, we have a very responsible job, right? It's very specific. It's December 24th. That's impossible. I'll explain what's going on now.

G. CHARTISHVILI: We propose to attract new people here, that’s all.

B. NEMTSOV: We are for new people, but we think that your leaving is wrong.

S. PARKHOMENKO: I think that the reaction to this will be quite obvious. I want to remind you that, after all, for now the exchange of opinions largely takes place on FaceBook. A so-called “event” was created there, an event called “December 24 on Vasilyevsky Spusk”. There, well, as of yesterday evening, when I went there, there were approximately 13 thousand people, I think that now it is significantly more. Anyone who has FaceBook in front of them, please look at how much it is now. I think that there it will be possible to express your opinion on this idea of Akunin and Parfenov to make these chairs replaceable, and for them to drop out of further work. To be honest, I am categorically against this, but, nevertheless, this question will be raised there. If necessary, we will organize a vote there - this is all very easy to determine. In the end, Leonid Parfenov appeared here precisely as a result of voting. Let's see what the next question yields.

Well? Moving on to questions? Yes, I would like, after all, for representatives of professional media to ask us questions now, we are moving into the mode of such a small press conference.

B. NEMTSOV: We should finish in 20 minutes.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Well, we have 20 minutes for this press conference. Yes, let's try not to break it. Forward. Admit who you are and where you come from.

- Timofey Dzyadko, editor of Forbes magazine. I wanted to ask, after all, about the organizing committee and its composition, because now there was a proposal from Parfenov and Akunin to make 2 places rotating. And the rest of the places - will they change somehow, will it somehow expand or have you, including Ilya Ponomarev, agreed that the composition will be exactly like this? Thank you.

B. NEMTSOV: May I answer? Friends, what do we want? Listen, what do we want to do? Do we want to disrupt December 24th? Just a second! The ideal option to disrupt everything is to rotate everyone here, every day.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Make new decisions on this issue every time.

B. NEMTSOV: Cancel the decisions that were made by the previous ones, because they are nobody and there is no way to call them, and make your own. If that's what you want, then this is the perfect option. I am against Parfenov and Grigory leaving, I think it’s wrong. We have to be responsible people: if you’ve already decided to do it, you have to do it. Further. I agree that Ilya is holding an event today, there will be a lot of people there, they will have a lot of ideas and so on and so forth. But now to create this mess (there’s no other way to say it), you know, I worked as a governor and deputy prime minister, I know what rotation is like every day. If you want to destroy an organization, rotate it every day - remove bosses from work, install new ones. There will be no organization. Therefore, there is no need to do this.

L. PARFENOV: Listen, we talked about the fact that there should be a professionally working executive committee, right? And this is a round table that warms up a certain ideology, throws in some ideas, and so on, and so on. We expressed our ideas. And to work in the executive committee... Well, which of us are executive committee members, God forgive me?

B. NEMTSOV: No, no, no, no need.

V. RYZHKOV: Maybe you will have 3 more excellent candidates.

L. PARFENOV: It will be, I will find a way to convey it. But I'm unlikely to have it. I have... I actually spoke about this at the rally, that it is necessary to reckon, that it is necessary to create an association of voters. Because, well, otherwise the result is just a certain sum of people who are dissatisfied in their own or in other people’s areas with some general crazy statistics, right? That's all. We need to understand how many there are? Million? 10 million? 20?

- Can i ask you? Radio Liberty.

I. PONOMAREV: I just really think this question is fundamentally important, the most important one we have now. I completely agree with Leonid, I also perceive our today’s meeting as a kind of round table, an extremely important one of representative people, but, nevertheless, precisely in this capacity. The decision maker should only accept what is created on an open basis, in which anyone can take part. And the first decisions, in fact, should be permanent working groups, so that there is no chaos, that’s right, a clear organizational structure. But these working groups must be formed from below, not from above. And I really hope that we will create some working groups this evening, we will create some working groups based on who has gathered today, and they will work and no one from, there, FaceBook, VKontakte, the political party Questions will arise as to why these and not those. Because everyone will have the opportunity to participate in the selection of these people.

- Radio Liberty, Elena Vlasenko. I have a technical question. It is probably addressed to Boris Nemtsov and Sergei Parkhomenko. When you chose this specific place, this day and this hour, did you inform representatives of other parties, say, Yabloko or the communists? And did they, in a conversation with you, refuse to participate in this event today?

S. PARKHOMENKO: We did not inform any parties about anything.

- And why?

S. PARKHOMENKO: Because this is not a party rally, that’s all. Individuals gather for this rally, just like the previous rally. When I submitted an application together with other applicants for this rally, I did not write there that it would be a party rally. And I, if he were a party member, would not participate in this group of applicants. That's all. Thank you. Ask.

- Nikolai Klemenyuk, Public Post. Firstly, I want to say, it’s very unfortunate that, after all, the creation of a voters’ association is being postponed until the rally, and is not being launched...

S. PARKHOMENKO: It’s not a fact that it is being postponed. The people who are now sitting in this very FaceBook event hear us and I have no doubt at all that they are now discussing this proposal among themselves. And I have no doubt at all that something will be done now.

- While they write that it’s a pity that Parfenov...

S. PARKHOMENKO: You don’t see the closed chat, you don’t see the closed chat of the organizers of this event. I think there will be some answer to this today.

- In any case, I wanted to ask this. The authorities, as was said from the very beginning, will obviously ignore the demands of the first rally, and it is quite possible that they will ignore the demands of the second rally. Is there any rough idea of what to do if there is no response? And is there any idea of finding some kind of negotiators, perhaps, who could communicate with the authorities on behalf of the protesters? Thank you.

V. RYZHKOV: I will answer briefly. The fact is that the rally on Bolotnaya is not formally reduced to 5 demands. The atmosphere in the country and public sentiment are changing very much. If after the 2nd mass action the authorities also ignore the demands of the people (and let me remind you that our resolution was called “Resolution of a general civil rally” - not a party one, but a general civil one), then this will undermine the legitimacy of the government even more, undermine the legitimacy of the Duma, undermine the legitimacy president. Therefore, the answer is very simple: continuation of this work, especially since there will be a structure, unification of voters, continuation of these actions, continued pressure on the authorities, there will definitely be a result. If people actively participate in this, there will be results - there is no doubt about it.

B. NEMTSOV: There is one more point here.

- Representative of the protesters.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Can I not give the floor to a representative of the protesters, but give the floor to professional journalists, because we have switched to press conference mode. Please, what media do you represent?

B. NEMTSOV: Look, you need to understand that the 24th is, apparently, the last major rally before the New Year, right? But on the other hand, in January, when protest activity, I think, will continue, it will become clear that March 4 is on the agenda. The authorities are shaking like a leaf before the elections, and they honestly cannot win. The closer March 4th comes, the more shaking there is. I have a feeling that our demands, including those of a political nature, will not only be heard, but will begin to be fulfilled. They will begin to do so not because they are so weak and so on, but because they are afraid like fire that they will have to throw in not 13 million votes, but 25, for example, right? But Churov has already proven his effectiveness and we also more or less now know his potential. Therefore, I think that the continuation of protest activity in January and February may lead to these 5 demands being met. We must continue to do this. You have to, you know, be persistent and stubborn, and not be afraid of anything. And at the same time peaceful, and friendly.

S. PARKHOMENKO: There is a well-known style of conversation in this case. After a rally of 60 thousand or 80 thousand people, whose demands were not answered, a rally of 100 thousand people gathers. Then a rally of 500 thousand people gathers. And so on until these answers are received.

L. PARFENOV: You know, I’m a little afraid of such convincing optimism hovering in this room, I would be careful not to say so, and in general I would like that, well, this mood of “our hearts have already completely demanded change”, it would somehow... then he didn’t dominate. Unfortunately... How's it going? The heart of a hipster is prone to betrayal and change like the wind in May, and on the contrary, I fear that what happened on the 10th is the first and brightest flash. In this sense, I urge those who came to the rally, those who are now following the discussion on various networks, discussing something there, writing various comments, to somehow think about their readiness to be in this mood for a long time, here , not to lose it, to continue to feel it not with a momentary mood, not with fashion, which was clearly on Sunday (I have nothing against it), but with such an inner conviction that would force you to take the next steps and maintain this mood within yourself. For now, I have concerns that this self-discipline and self-awareness as a voter may only be enough for the first week after the truly stunningly implausible election results.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Very reasonable. This is a long story and the people who are hearing us now must understand this and must, so to speak, gather their strength and gather the strength of those with whom they are talking next to. This is extremely important, it is the basis of everything. If this does not happen, then all our conversations here are absolutely meaningless. Yes please.

- Dear colleagues, these are just us here, representatives of the white ribbon, comrades-in-arms of the white ribbon, groups on FaceBook. So we just came here to support you and say thank you so much. And, regarding the executive committees, we are ready, for our part, to join this executive committee and support.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Great. Thank you, we will definitely contact you, there is no doubt. After our meeting, I will take direct coordinates from you.

- Yes. And plus the same thing, we also represent all regions and other online media.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Excellent. Technically it is very simple.

- One literally word in addition. It’s just that we are the same people from FaceBook who are not members of any parties and who can bring new faces, fresh forces to your movement...

V. RYZHKOV: To ours, to our movement.

- To our movement... I’m already afraid to say the word “Ours”.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Everything, everything, agreed.

- Ours and ours are different.

- It's clear. There are many of us, you understand. We, as it were, united into a civil association, spontaneous, spontaneous, non-partisan. But, here, with you, we are close in terms of goals and attitudes. Don't forget about us, because we are the ones who worked.

S. PARKHOMENKO: My journalistic mind is in full swing, because questions should be asked at a press conference. I somehow think about what my colleagues are going through now, who don’t have time to ask questions. Question please.

G. GUDKOV: Well, taking advantage of today’s press conference, I would just like to urge Russian citizens to come to these rallies. I am deeply convinced that they are very important, that, unfortunately, in an era of political deafness of the authorities, they are the only peaceful instrument of pressure on the authorities and a mechanism when the authorities change course and change the situation in the country. There are no other methods. Therefore, the more Russian citizens there are who are conscious and responsible, and who are convinced that they are right, the faster we will achieve results. Under no circumstances should we weaken our zeal and desire today; we need to be persistent, courageous, patient, and we will definitely achieve success. I invite everyone to come to the rally and subsequent events.

S. PARKHOMENKO: Thank you. We are meeting in this composition on Friday from three to five, but in fact we are meeting on December 24, most likely on Vasilievsky Spusk, from two to six at the appointed time. And so, watch out for advertising, as they say. There will be a transfer, so there will be a transfer. Thanks everyone.

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