Biblical stories

From the interlocutor

When the time of the announcement of the next Nobel Prize in Literature comes up, I hope to hear the name Meir Shallev. The political situation is not too favorable to this, but few people living it seemed to a greater extent.

The main genres of Shawlev: novels, essays, children's stories, newspaper speakers.

The novels are united by the poetry of the first "pioneers" -pers and the irony of their descendants. They are closer to the ground than much, which is commonly called realism. This does not interfere with fantastic details to look completely organic there.

The essay about the Bible tells about it as the most famous source of stories and jokes, which have become examples for other stories and for the life of hundreds of generations.

Like most Israeli intellectuals of the last decades, shawl is left. Not to kisses with terrorists and doubts about the justification of the existence of their state, but to the extent that any government coalition that can arise today or tomorrow will be noticeable to the right.

The constant critical position does not at all interfere with the interaction of Shalev (as well as his colleagues in the left camp - Amos Oz, David Grossman or A.B. Jehoshua) and the state in the field of humanitarian policy - dating the world with Israeli culture. An example is an interview that took place during a recent visit to Russia with the help of the Embassy of the State of Israel. Its first part is devoted mainly to creativity. The second is society.

Boris Dolgin

Some of your books were inspired by the Bible. How has your view of the Bible changed after these books?

I would not say that my views have somehow changed radically. Perhaps, of course, I found in the Bible something new for myself. But my approach, which, in general, consists in reading the Bible from a non -religious point of view, has not changed in any way.

With this approach, we do not consider the characters as saints, we can analyze them and even judge them. I think the Bible does it itself. This already later rabbinistic interpretations represent them in an invulnerable form for criticism.

Of course, I use in my books some attributes of biblical characters and the biblical manner of the narrative, when there is little information about psychological experiences in the story. This moment really delights me, because sometimes, when you read modern literature, it seems that there is too much psychological information. The Bible only reports what people said and did, and you yourself already guess what psychological processes are behind this. Something in this spirit I try to do in my books.

There is an opinion that the Bible was the first truly historical book. What do you think about the role of history in the formation of a nation, human representations?

When we talk about the history of nations, we see that history can sometimes be very flexible, that it is very easy to process. Take, for example, my country. What we describe as a war for the independence of 1948 is called and described in Palestinian sources completely different. The same can be said about the history of many other countries of the world.

And about the Bible itself, it cannot be said that it was a reliable historical source. But in general, this is a story. I think, not only in literary work, but also in history there is a certain element of artistry.

Are there clear boundaries between literature and journalism, artistic and non -artistic literature? What area do you belong to?

I have one book that I consider not fiction, but with memoirs. This is a book about my grandmother, about the vacuum cleaner, “Sviper” and about her manic cleanliness (we are talking about the book “It was so” - B.D.).

I wrote this book with the intention to finally tell a true story. And of course, as I wrote, I received more and more diverse, sometimes conflicting evidence from my relatives, more and more versions of the same events. And then I noticed that I periodically tempt to make some artistic changes into this story. Thus, the boundaries between these things are surrounded by a zone of uncertainty.

Nevertheless, I see a psychological difference between artistic and non -artistic literature. When you write a work of art, you understand that you can invent your own story, you can use your imagination. And when you write non-fiction, you are at least striving for a true description of the facts.

And the border between literature and journalism?

Well, again, if we are talking about reporting or journalism (for example, I am publishing a column weekly in the newspaper Yedioth Ahronoth), then the difference between journalism and literature is that it is that

In the column, I strive to express my opinion, and in the book I try to tell the story.

But some of your books are created on the basis of your newspaper publications. About the Bible, for example ...

Many years ago, I printed several articles about the Bible, but these were not a column. This series of articles about the Bible really formed the basis of the Bible today. And then another series of articles is the basis of the book “For the first time in the Bible”. But I have never collected my speakers in the book. And if I do this, then it will be an anthology, a collection of articles, but not a work of art.

When I write a column, first of all, I want to put forward some kind of idea-about politics or culture-or to transmit some information that, it seems to me, will be interesting to the reader. And I, of course, try to write it the best as possible. And when I write a novel, the main thing is to tell a story, build it, describe the characters.

I try to write professionally in both genres, but these are two completely different types of writing.

What do you like to read more? Fiction? Non-fiction?

I prefer mainly fiction. The two best books from the category of non-fiction that I read recently belonged to the pen of the same author-a linguist. This is Guy Deutscher, who lives in Holland. He wrote two beautiful books about languages ​​(about Hebrew and other languages, about their development). They are especially good for people who are interested in this topic, but do not have an academic education in the field of linguistics. That is, these are high -level work, but set forth in an accessible form for people.

But I still read good novels more. I like the stories less. To my shame, I must admit that now I almost do not read poetry. I used to read a lot, now - much less. I also sometimes read children's books - I like them.

Apparently, you like not only to read children's books.

Yes, I also write them.

And from fiction - what was the last?

It was the novel by Philip Rot “Ghost” (“Exit Ghost”). I liked him.

By the way, reading children's literature is important to me. I began to do this when I was four years old - my parents then taught me how to read. I remember with what delight I read good children's books when I was five, six, seven years old. Since fourteen, I began to read serious novels, but even the best of them did not cause me such delight as those books for children when I was five years old.

This is a mysterious moment in children's literature, and I am trying to find a clue. Of course, something here is due to the personal qualities of the young reader, but there is still something special in children's books, and I try to preserve it in my own novels.

There are books for adults that began to be perceived as children's. Such as Robinson Crusoe, Gulliver's Travels ...

As for Gulliver, I don’t understand why he became a children's work. Perhaps because of his adventure atmosphere. And Robinson, in general, from the very beginning was a rather infantile work. Maybe Daniel Defoe did not plan to write a children's book, but in the end it was she. I read this book in a shorter form when I was nine or ten years old, and I really liked it. And then, when I grew up, I read the full version, but it did not seem too interesting to me.

What will your next books be about?

Now I am writing a novel in which we will talk about revenge. One of the heroes of this book is going to carry out cruel revenge. He will kill a person.

I must say that, oddly enough, I will identify myself with this avenger, although I have never avenge in my life. Of course, sometimes I could be very angry with someone, even invented various terrible things that I could do with this person, but I never really took revenge. And the book really has revenge, and I like to write it. It is very different from my other books, although this is not a detective and not a thriller.

What do you think of people who translate almost all your works into Russian - is Alla Furman and Rafail Nudelman? How do you maintain contacts in the process of their work?

We meet from time to time. Sometimes we correspond to e -mail. Sometimes they have questions about my texts, but more often - very valuable comments.

I do not know the Russian language, so I can’t appreciate their work, but whoever I asked, everyone had a very high opinion. I got the impression that they translate very accurately.

I think that I am best translated into Russian, Dutch, German and English (I read in English myself). And I am very grateful to these translators.

I will tell you one thing that seems to me very interesting.

Wherever I went, in any country, whether Germany, America, Canada or Italy - readers of Russian translations of my books are everywhere among the audience.

It's just incredible. If, for example, I am going to America, I do not meet the Italians who read Italian translations there. But there will certainly be Russian -speaking readers with Russian publications.

I believe that this is, first of all, the merit of my translators, partly mine. Well, and, of course, this is the merit of the native speakers themselves - regular readers of my books.

Boris Dolgin talked.