Knitting: Poklonnaya vs swamp

On February 4, “not a single voice to Vladimir Putin,” on Poklonnaya Gora, they called “enemies” in Bolotnaya Square. The arguments of the parties found out The New Times*

Participants in the discussion:

Olga Romanova is the leader of the informal organization "Rus Sitting"

Mikhail Leontyev - TV presenter, editor -in -chief of the magazine "However"

Questions: Evgenia Albats

“Bolotnaya wallet” had a residence permit on Yandex. Did Poklonnaya have his own public wallet? Who financed the rally, including the buses on which people brought?

Leontyev: I don't know, this is unprincipled for me. In the country there are political organizations of the Posoputinsky, which, by the way, have some resources.

Romanova: As for our wallet and the money of the State Department, the rule of Yandex-he does not accept either a cent, even kill yourself.

Behind the scenes

Leontyev: I am sure that Olya made all transactions regarding this public wallet of the rally in accordance with the law. Another thing is that before the money through Yandex got into the “wallet”, they could be in some other accounts.

That is, after all, the State Department?

Leontyev: Why is the State Department necessarily? We have a lot of people ... for example, the money that comes to these needs from London.

Romanova: Who bought me?

Leontyev: It begins ... I’m not talking about “bought”, I say that the interests of a significant part of Russian economic and Kremlin elites are related to destabilization and with an attempt to remove Putin, they don’t like it, tired. I think that the State Department does not pay those who went out into the street with protests. The State Department, and not only the State Department, but a lot of structures, including Russian, pay for the organization of infrastructure that prepares this. Not a rally directly. A rally is a result. Well, we know how this was done in Kyiv, we know how it was done here, how it was done in Serbia. It is quite obvious to me that the connection between the “swamp” and “Kremlin” is not a connection, it is a flowing vessel.

Oh! Is the marsh connected with the Kremlin?

Leontyev: Well, these are the elites! These are representatives of a large extent glamorous party, there were so -called oligarchs, that is, a large Russian business.

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Olga Romanova: I don’t like Putin not because he is ugly, pale and inappropriate, but because in 12 years he failed to establish a normal mechanism of power

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Romanova: I have the feeling that, it seems, I know all the people who go to Bolotnaya and Sakharov. I know the Street Art group, for example: used to be engaged in street art, now they have switched to banners. These are managers mainly. Their leader Kolya Belyaev told me: “Ol, I was not interested in this by December 4, I lived my private life, except that I went to Seliger every summer and overwhelmed the ourselves, and my half of the group consists of ourselves who left Seliger.” I know the group "Stewardesses", my favorite group. These are girls, beauty, led by Nadia and Anechka. The first in a year or for two groups, which comes on Sundays to Lubyanka with sponge, with a soap: they wash the Solovetsky stone and leave. I know the Cheburashki group, a group called “Resistance”, I know one more that helps Dr. Lisa, for example. Such quite fashionable boys with earrings. I know the group “White ribbons” and the “White Tape” group, I know the group from the small Chelyabinsk city, Igor heads it: he raises small cities to protest movements ...

And what are you, the organizing committee, relations with the Kremlin? Or with groups of interests close to Medvedev?

Romanova: Today I personally, together with Gennady Gudkov, supported the conversation with Dmitry Medvedev’s clan about the list of obviously unlawfully convicted for political reasons: I went to the presidential administration, where I maintained relations with the Kremlin clan in the person of Mikhail Fedotov*.

On different sides

Michael, you said in your speech from Poklona Pokluna: "These" swamp "people are either idiots or traitors, or rather, idiots led by traitors." All 70 thousands are idiots?

Leontyev: There is probably a part of a small part, which is Putin’s political opponents - they walked political columns. There is a very large part, which is collected through the Internet. This is a well -fed, well -had breakfast, responding to the middle class. The third category is the Moscow Economic party: a small business, an office employee. These are people who have experienced a blow to the first wave of crisis, it hits them first, and are in a state of deep neurosis. And they need a personifier of this neurosis. The best personifier, of course, is our power.

And yet, why do you consider them idiots?

Intelligent parties are not connected with the people and do not understand that they will not be able to restrain the distinguished masses and Russia will be plunged into a disaster! The authorities, whatever it may be, is the last damper between this energy of violence and those idiots that go to the swamp. And people on Poklonnaya understand what the "orange scenario" is. From the fact that a bloody bathhouse will happen in Russia, you are no better and no better for them. And it is for that that they hate marsh!

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Mikhail Leontyev: In the current situation, Putin is a barrier from violence. Putin will not - to sort things out with Bolotnaya will have to almost force

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Romanova: Poklonnaya was terrible, very aggressive. I don’t understand why people who support quite biblical commandments - do not steal, do not false evidence, that is, do not falsify - why are they immediately called the enemies of Russia? If I don't like Putin, then I am the enemy of the country. I do not like Putin not because he is ugly, pale and inappropriate - not therefore. I do not like the fact that in 12 years he failed to establish a normal mechanism. There is no institution of the prosecutor's office, there is no institution of the court, there is no normal mechanism for changing power. Swamp - in order for the mechanism to work.

Enemies and traitors

Leontyev: Why is the worshiper aggressive? Because she categorically does not like you. And she will not allow you. She sincerely considers you an instrument of demolition of the Russian authorities and the collapse of the country. Putin is an unconditional leader in these elections. And you have already announced these elections illegitimate! That is, you want to demolish the legal system. And this means a revolution in Russia. And we cannot allow it.

Romanova: And you want to push the Poklonnaya and Bolotnaya?

Leontyev: No, I don't want to push. But one must understand: when suddenly in Bolotnaya they felt that they could collect these “hamsters” in the amount of 100 thousand people, they decided: now they will dictate their will contrary to everything - contrary to reality, statistics, contrary to Russian history.

Romanova: Can I not like Putin further?

Leontyev: I don't like it - this is one thing. But you want to impose your will, want Putin to leave. Your leaders and puppeteers have already said: "We do not recognize the results of any elections."

Puppeteers - who is this? And who is the "traitors" who lead "idiots"?

Leontyev: For me, traitors are Nemtsov, Navalny, Kasyanov ... These people are a direct hired agent of the enemy, enemy. They work with his money. People standing behind an unsystematic opposition.

How can this situation end?

Romanova: Sooner or later they will be set to everyone else who does not like thieves in power. This aggression will result in a best case in a marine. And with Mordobia, we very quickly go into the bloody bath, unfortunately. We will be wetted: people who do not like the authorities who want changes for some reason. But people will come out anyway, as they went to Bolotnaya for the first time.

Leontyev: We will observe attempts to increase pressure on power with a high probability of provocations and excesses. The Syrian version is the customer’s dream, the dream of those whom I called traitors ... But the authorities will not allow any violence. In the current situation, Putin precisely because of his halfness is a barrier from violence. Putin will not - it will be almost force to sort things out with Bolotnaya.

And who will it be?

Leontyev: If people related to the so -called security forces who went through the wars who served, who are now serving, they decide that they are draining the country for the second time ...

Olga, do you want to object?

Romanova: I want 100 grams ...

Photo: Roman Goncharov/The New Times