Marina Litvinenko: "There will be no statute of limitations"

On January 21, the judge of the Royal Court of London, Sir Robert Owen, published his report on the case of Alexander Litvinenko, who was killed at the end of November 2006. The judge called Andrei Lugovoi and Dmitry Kovtun with probable murder performers. And most importantly: in his report, the judge indicated that this murder was “probably approved” by the former head of the FSB, and now the head of the Security Council, General Nikolai Patrushev and Russian President Vladimir Putin. For nine years, this investigation went on, nine years the trial was opened or stopped again, for nine years this topic did not leave the pages of NT: the murder of the KGB-FSB lieutenant colonel and the role in this Russian state and its special services were the main theme of the very first issue of The New Times magazine. We talked about all this with the widow of the murdered Marina Litvinenko in London a few weeks before the decision of the decision of Judge Owen

Is this the final of the investigation or the next intermediate stage?

This is not the end, because the conclusion according to the results of the open hearings will not be a sentence. But there is no time limit. For investigators, Lugovoi and Kovtun remain suspects.

In a circle

* * It seemed to many that the situation came to a dead end: Lugovoi would not appear in England, Kovtun says that he would testify, then refuses again. However, you managed to achieve hearings, and it seems that the UK authorities are ready to publish what their law enforcement agencies and special services managed to find. Tell us how the events developed. ****

In short, then the story is as follows: the case was opened immediately after Sasha was in the hospital. After Sasha died ( November 23, 2006. - NT ), it was retrained in the murder. In February 2007, the case was transferred to the prosecutor's office. And already in May, the prosecutor's office said that they suspect a meadow. Then a request for meal extradition was submitted. By the first anniversary (murder), we already understood who the killer was. The police said: we want to arrest them. We said you will not arrest them, because no one will extradite them.

“Them” is the meadow and Kovtun?

Yes. We could submit a petition for the investigation, this is the right that a citizen has in England. When it comes to a dead end, it cannot be brought to court, but it can be transferred to another jurisdiction, the so -called inquiry, which should collect and show the entire evidence base. That is, not to reason - it may not, why these people are accused, but to show: on the basis of what facts the charge is being charged. At first I was asked not to do this, not to accelerate the process, because the police continued the investigation, collected the evidence base. I was waiting. When five years have passed since my husband’s death, I realized that there was nothing more to wait. And in 2011, I made a decision: we go and submit to the inquiry.

“And at the hearing in December 2012, Judge Robert Owen reports: the Russian state stands behind this story”

From the very beginning, the Great Britain government started talking about secrecy, about not allowing journalists to hear. But we defended this right (to open hearings). The first coroner ( a special judge, whose duties include clarifying the causes of death that occurred in suspicious circumstances. - NT ), who conducted this process, said: “Questions of publicity regarding certain issues that will be addressed, I will decide, not the government.” At the first meeting, a break was announced in the process: the prosecutor's office asked for time to finalize documents. As we subsequently understood, they charged Kovtun. That is, they needed to perform a number of formalities. If the requirement of extradition was put forward in relation to the meadow, then they decided to do otherwise with Kovtun: they sent a request for the arrest of Kovtun to the Russian Intercopol. The Russian Interpol immediately informed Kovtun: there is a request for you. And Kovtun immediately ran an interview: I know that they want to arrest me. Further ... In February 2012, we will find out that our coroner was suspended. This was not due to our investigation, but it became an unpleasant event for us. We began to wait for the appointment of a new coroner: it was not a special puff - just in English justice everything goes slowly. In short, in June 2012 a new coroner was appointed. Preliminary meetings took place, then public hearings began. And at the hearing in December 2012, Judge Robert Owen reports two important things. Firstly, he has already seen enough materials that give him the right to say: the Russian state is behind this story. Secondly, that Lugovoi also became an interested side.

The interested party is provided by all the materials that will subsequently be announced in court - under the subscription of non -disclosure. And Lugovoi now also gained access to these materials.

Alexander Litvinenko was painful. Photo November 20, 2006

Is this a problem?

Not immediately. First, in February 2013, William Heig, the Foreign Minister of Great Britain at that time ( until July 14, 2014. - NT ), said that some materials are very “sensitive”, “confidential” and it is impossible to use them in the court upon open consideration. And then Lugovoi collects a press conference and, waving documents, including “confidential”, says: I get out of this process, because I do not consider it fair.

Hage vs Judge Owen

What were these documents?

The information on the basis of which he is suspected: that he was there and there, he left Polonia and here ... In short, Heig imposes a ban on secret materials, and instead of a meadow, the Russian Investigative Committee asks for the process. We were against, believing that this would lead to the disorientation of the whole process. But they were given this opportunity, which once again confirms the objectivity of the English court. And they brought with them three thousand pages of materials in Russian, which had to be translated. And already in April (2013), Robert Owen says that William Hage prohibits almost all materials in the open court. The judge writes a letter to me: “Unfortunately, I cannot put forward a version of the involvement of the Russian state without any more relevant documents.”

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Judge Sir Robert Owen believes that the Russian state is behind the murder of Litvinenko

So once again everything stopped ...

Owen offered us a different form of the process: a public trial. This means that these documents can be considered, but - behind closed doors, behind which only those who have appropriate admission can be present. Neither I nor my lawyers were among them. Theoretically, you can hire a lawyer with a tolerance, but this is pointless: he will look at these documents, but he will not tell us what he saw there.

“Hage imposes a ban on secret materials, and instead of a meadow, the Russian Investigative Committee asks for the process”

I trust Robert Owen and make his decision: we move on to public proceedings. Now we must get an answer from the government, we have the right not to inquiry, but to a public trial? We are waiting. No answer, no greetings. June passes, July begins. Robert Owen appoints a meeting on July 12. We come, sitting in the courtroom, Owen comes out, so all steamed, I would say, and says: the Minister of the Interior Teresa Mei called. The government does not give us the right to public proceedings. The minister sent us a letter with argumentation. Firstly, the transition to a new form of process is additional funds of taxpayers. Secondly, a public trial may affect relations between the two countries. They say to me: you can file a complaint against it. But this is risky. You will lose - you will pay. So, they give me 72 hours to decide whether I am going to sue with Teresa Mei or not. At the same time, if I lose, I will have to pay 50 thousand pounds to the government of Her Majesty ... I ask: how quickly it will be necessary to pay money? They say not right away, you will have some time. I decide: then we will scream the “guard”! And she went to sue Teresa Mei. This is the royal court, I am and three judges. On the calendar - January 2014. Two days of the meeting, one day my lawyer performed for six hours, the second day of Her Majesty's lawyer. And in February we get a decision: the arguments of Teresa May have no reason, and she has no right to refuse public trial. Now her glove is thrown, she is given 72 hours, will she appeal this court decision? She refused. So in February 2014, we get the right to demand a public trial.

We are waiting again. Crimea, events in Ukraine, July - are shot down by the Malaysian Boeing, and finally, a week later in parliament they announce that we are given permission to public trial. Everyone believes that this is because of a downed aircraft. This is wrong. In short, in July 2014, Robert Owen reports that he appoints public trial for January 2015. And in September 2014, the Investigative Committee solemnly left the process ...

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*The polnium trace probably leads to the State Duma of the Russian Federation - to the deputy chairman of the Committee on Security and Countering Corruption Andrei Lugovoi, Moscow, December 1, 2015 *

IC RF VS Judge Owen

Based on?

They, they say, do not understand what it is at all - a public trial ...

In any case, they did not lie - they really do not understand.

And they went out. But by the way, their lawyers remained, and when the hearings began, every day they sat at work. Very strong and expensive English lawyers. The same that they represented meadow. In short, the public trial began on January 27, 2015.

Could you attend the hearings, the documents were available?

Yes. And the documents are posted on the Internet, are available now. And if during the trial some unpleasant information was announced, the journalists had every right to use it, not afraid that they would be attracted to the court. Why couldn't Viktor Ivanov withstand? ( This refers to a large interview with the head of the FSKN Viktor Ivanov, where he stated that the London court became a “a mouthpiece for the replication of slanderous information.” - NT ) People were nervous because they were announced that they did not really like it. But the most important thing, how the experts acted there ... I was embarrassed for Russia, for my country, which, instead of presenting the same experts in response, simply stated that we would not discuss this, because it has no reason.

What experts do you mean?

Experts-doctors, radiologists, scientists-nuclear scientists, and all-the highest level. Representatives of the police, who sequentially described everything from the moment Sasha began to testify in the hospital: the exceptional situation was that the investigation of the murder was on the basis of an interview of the murdered. And therefore, when he said where and when, with whom he met, the police were just just to come to this place and check whether there are traces of Polonia or not.

All this was clearly organized. The police told how they traveled to Russia, how they examined the planes, while not just told - provided data on the examinations, a huge number of documentation and facts: phone calls, tickets, banking transactions, payment of accounts in restaurants, at the hotel. That is, for example, every step of meadow in London is each, it is documented. Polonium vs Lugovoi and Kovtun

And the conclusion of the police?

The presence of traces of polonium in those places where and when was meadow. Sasha left behind the traces of a man who was infected: this is what was allocated with later and so on. Lugovoi was not infected, these were only traces of radiation, touches. The most “dirty” was a room at the Sheraton Hotel on October 26 and 27 (2006), where Lugovoi was alone.

Nine years ago, the media wrote that Kovtun was irradiated.

When in December 2006 the police came to Moscow to interrogate Kovtun in the hospital, everything was not clear there. He was all sown, so Kovtun was or not Kovtun, you won’t understand. It is impossible to identify. Lugovoi said that he personally was never infected. "The exclusivity of the situation is that the investigation about the murder was based on an interview with the murdered."

How did he manage to protect himself, even if the door of his number in the “Sharaton” fonil?

As experts explained, Polonium is dangerous only if you swallowed it: if you just touched, nothing happens to you - polonium does not penetrate through your skin.

Now it is clear why Lugovoi was not afraid to contact Polonia. Is there information in the documents, where did this Polonius come from?

No, of course, only Lugovoi and Kovtun could say this. But the hearings said that the Poloniy open market is not anywhere in the world, the amount that was used against Sasha was impossible to buy. Polonium is produced only in Russia, and it could only be obtained from the atomic reactor - this is an expert opinion.

Once again: in the documents of the court hearings it is indicated that there is no open market, is the floor produced only in Russia, can you get only in this way?

Yes.

And what was the role of Kovtun?

I don’t know what role Kovtun had, because it is not known which of them is the main one. Lugovy could be used simply as an eyeliner, because he was a familiar Sasha. And Kovtun appeared only in October (2006) and under very strange circumstances. I remember Sasha told me that Lugovoi came with his friend, terribly unpleasant. A muddy, incomprehensible person. The former military man served in the GDR, then suddenly ended up in West Germany. He did not live the time that is needed to get a residence permit, left for Russia.

Why did Kovtun suddenly decide to testify?

Yes, we were already waiting for the completion of the process-by March 31, 2015, suddenly, like a damn thing, Kovtun jumps, and another comedy begins. He sent a letter: that he also wants to become an interested party. So, he will gain access to the documents, just like all of us. He was invited - he did not react, refused. And when the court should end, he collects a press conference at which he declares: I want to be interested in, I want to see all the secret documents. And I will prove that Litvinenko was sick before November 1, 2006 ( when Lugovoi and Kovtun met with Litvinenko. - NT ).

Kovtun is given time to collect all the necessary papers and submit to the right to be an interested party. Kovtun pulls, on June 15, 2015 he finally submits documents, says that he is ready to act on a video conference and testify in court. The date is set, and here Kovtun states that he is not sure that this does not violate Russian legislation. Transfer the next day. We are going again, a video is turned on, an engineer-gingead man sits, a translator sits. Aitshnik is asked: have you seen Kovtun today? Says: I saw. Will he testify? It won't. Everything, the video conference ends.

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*Former Soviet army officer Dmitry Kovtun did not speak in court, Moscow, December 1, 2015 *

After that, the Investigative Committee filed a lawsuit. Firstly, it is impossible for the testimony of Kovtun to be read out ... without it. Secondly, all documents ( in particular, the explanations of Kovtun by Russian investigators. - NT ), which the Investigative Committee represented and which were almost posted on the website, they put the ban on retroactively: they say, we gave them for investigation, and you used them in public proceedings. I think, is Robert Owen really and will say, yes, yes, we are so tolerant ... No, we won’t get sick, Judge Owen said: “We warned you, you have never answered us. This is how the documents were posted on the website, so they will remain there. ” And Kovtun’s written testimony were read out, and they were fully contradictory with what he spoke in Russia. Both by dates and in time. And this is enough in court, if a person lies in one, then his testimony has no power. And on July 31, 2015, open hearings were closed. Judge Robert Owen retired for consideration. Now, finally, his decision will be announced.

Litvinenko vs Russian state

What will be the consequences of this decision?

Recommendations to the government. That is, the judge says: you now know that Russia used radioactive material in the UK, and this should be recognized as a fact. Second: people who are called suspects in the murder are already waiting for their justice. If they travel outside Russia, they will be arrested.

That is, both Kovtun and Lugovoi can only be in Russia?

Yes. And this decision has no statute of limitations. In addition, it will be possible to raise the question: how is the person against whom such serious accusations are made is not just a member of the State Duma, but also the deputy chairman of the Committee on Security and Countering Corruption? If earlier they said: provide us with evidence, and we will consider this ( the question of the stay of the meadow in the State Duma. - NT ), now we can answer them that there are necessary evidence. I want to ask: and how are you, deputies, now do the meadow?

Marina, do you now have an understanding why, after all, the Russian state or its special departments went to eliminate your husband? What is “Retribution will overtake anyone and everyone”? That is, the punishment was going to the enemy’s side: after all, there were reports that Alexander Litvinenko worked for the English and Spanish intelligence services? Or something else?

No, Sasha never worked for English intelligence. But he advised. He gave his advice both English and Spanish intelligence.

“They say that when they came to Tony Blara with this issue - there is such a Litvinenko, he just grabbed his head and talked his feet: forget”

When? When was he back in Moscow or when he already arrived in London?

When I arrived.

Consulted, but did not work?

No. Until his last day, Sasha did not even have a state number of social insurance. And no one would have hired it without it. Sasha was a public figure enough to be an employee of some special services. He could tell the connection between the mafia structures that occupied Spain and the first persons of the Russian state ( meaning the case of the “Russian Mafia in Spain.” - NT wrote in detail about this in No. 40 of November 30, 2015), which was now confirmed.

Still, Litvinenko’s departure from Russia is similar to a well-thought-out operation. I understand that he was a very professional person, but he could not do without assistants.

Well, of course, he was helped, for example, Badri Patarkatsishvili was in Georgia, helped Sasha with documents. I left for Spain with a child on a tourist visa. It was like this: the first stage - Sasha had to get out of Russia, he was under the subscription about the lower room. Then in Sochi there was a ferry, and when he came to this ferry, he simply invested $ 10 or $ 20 into his passport, and the border guard looked the other way. So Sasha left for Georgia. Here connected (famous dissident Vladimir) Bukovsky. He tried to attract (the former colonel of foreign intelligence of the KGB of the USSR, who became a secret agent of British intelligence, who took him to the trunk from the USSR) Oleg Gordievsky, then (former GRU employee in Geneva) Suvorov. They say that when they came to Tony Blara ( British Prime Minister from May 1997 to June 2007. - NT ) with this issue-there is such a Litvinenko, he simply grabbed his head and pushed his feet: forget that there was nothing. Sasha is sitting in Georgia, they don’t do documents, I am sitting in Spain, there are three days before the end of the tour, and Sasha tells me if you do not go, I return to Moscow. And we fly to Turkey. We are sitting in Turkey. And Berezovsky says: “Let us put you on my boat, and you will swim while the French make a decision, they will want to make you.” Then Alik Goldfarb arrives ( one of the close associates of Boris Berezovsky. - NT ) and as a true American says: we will go to America. We come to Ankara, go to the American embassy. They listened to Sasha and say: you are not interesting to us. Alik offers: let's illegally enter America. I say, and what will happen next? Well, they will put you in prison. I say, and Tolya (son)? Well, Tolya, he says, someone will take it for trusteeship. I sit, sob, a six -year -old child in his arms ... And then Goldfarb has a different idea: you can go to England without a visa, he says: “Take a ticket through London, and there you will surrender.” In short, we flew in, go to the transit zone, there are police officers, and Sasha through the translator says: “I am a Russian special services officer, I want to ask for political asylum.”

Was Goldfarb with you?

Yes. For this, he was then made by all -in. And his son studied in England ... He could not come for a long time. For six years he was in American black lists.

And yet - for what?

I think that Sasha was ready to talk about financial interests ... You do not forget, Sasha in Moscow in prison served for nothing - it became clear to me: they would not be far behind. In addition, they immediately made it clear to me: this is Putin personally ( then, in 1998-1999 - the director of the FSB of the Russian Federation. - NT )

Do you expect justice will someday triumph?

It is already important that in open court hearings, the evidence was considered and Sasha’s killers were called. There is no statute of limitations for such cases, not today - so after 10 years, but they will be arrested and condemned. I am grateful to Judge Owen - he called a spade a spade.

 *Photo: Evgenia Albats, ITAR-TASS/Photos/PA Photos, John Stiuwell/Pool/AFP, Anton Novoderezhkin/TASS, Dmitry Dukhanin/Kommersant*