Vilnius harmony

Ivan Tolstoy: Let's start with the musical world of the Lithuanian composer Anatoly Shenderovas. The conversation with him was recorded by Irina Peters.

Irina Peters: Anatoly Mikhailovich Shenderovas (not to be confused with the Russian rocker Anatoly Shenderov), is a musician in all generations known to him. His father, Vilnius teacher Mikhail Schenderov, once noticed and trained the famous cellist David Gorringas. Anatoly himself, now the laureate of European and Lithuanian national awards, the cavalier of the Order of the Gediminas, was born in 1945 in Ulyanovsk, education received education in the Lithuanian and Leningrad Conservatory. The composer, gravitating to the non -romantic style, works in different genres, writes music for ballets and cinema, a favorite format - quartets. So recently in Germany, he recorded the “Music for strings” disc, which is performed by Lithuanian groups of Artvio and Fortavio.

Anatoly Shenderovas: The quartet is generally considered the most difficult work. This is a symphony for four tools. For a hundred instruments, for a symphony orchestra, a symphony is easier, more opportunities, and there are only four, everything is in sight, everything is heard, during a studio record - even more so.

Irina Peters: It is impossible to hide behind the sound of a large orchestra.

Anatoly Shenderovas: No. This is a complex genre, an intimate genre. I just wanted to speak out about life. In general, to talk about music what she is about is a meaningless business. These are just my thoughts expressed by sounds, not in words. If I could with words, I would write a letter, novel or story. And I wrote a quartet, a genre that is a little forgotten today. He was a very popular, starting from Haydn, there are the most magnificent quarters of Bartok, Shostakovich (fifteen fantastic quarters), Beethoven ... to return to this in vain for the forgotten genre, which has a lot of opportunities.

After one of the concerts, a woman from the public came up and says: “Are you a modern composer or not? Modern music-one that I can’t understand, I have nothing to catch on. But I somehow pleasantly listen to yours, I remember something, associations arise. But this is not typical for modern music. So, I am interested in who you are.” Modern composers have done a lot to push the audience. The first question is the most primitive, and it is the most important: like it - not like, beautiful - not beautiful? This is the first thing the viewer and the listener goes to the work of art.

Irina Peters: Experiments with the form far -reaching, began to prevail, and the spirit disappeared.

Anatoly Shenderovas: This is the reason because of which many people have a reserved attitude towards modern art. The concerts of modern music, which not everyone understands, or rather speak, almost no one understands, and even more precisely - almost no one feels, do not cause positive emotions. Composers managed to push the audience. There is our big fault in this. A departure from romanticism caused another extreme - constructivism took possession of everything. And the constructive beginning in music began to be valued higher than its spiritual state. This idea of constructivism has expanded at a huge speed, a lot of positive has been achieved in this area, a lot of positive, but it all depends on what is more important for the Creator - to express their constructive idea, and this is a goal, or to express a spiritual idea, and the constructive side, which is incredibly important for a professional work, it should be hidden in the background or in the third. It is very difficult. The first is easier and more precise. You have a constructive idea, you are walking on it. And it’s a completely different matter when you write music, which has always been part of a spiritual life, and gradually I did not know which. Who is in the hall, in the gallery is lost. He was told and he read that it was incredibly interesting, this has never happened, and he is trying to see it all, to hear, but he cannot and is tormented. They often say to me like this: "You know, I somehow do not really understand modern music, but I really want to understand it. I understand that I do not understand." And I want to understand, I want to be at the modern level.

Irina Peters: vulgarly in the trend.

Anatoly Shenderovas: Music, which has a spiritual basis, is also conceptual. Maybe even more.

Irina Peters: Someone said that your merit is like a composer, that you raised cello music to a new height.

Anatoly Shenderovas: I don’t know, I heard about this only now. A cello is not only a tool for me, it is a symbol. My father is a cellist. The first sounds that I heard childhood were the sounds of cello. Daily gamms, concerts, rehearsals, all this is cello, cello ... I almost became a cellist, studied for three months with my dad, but his patience ended quickly, I finished my career as a cellist, then I looked for for a long time who to become. David Geringas was a student of my dad. For the first six years, he studied at a music school at the conservatory, which is today called the art school of Cheurlenis, and then she was a ten -year -old, and my dad taught there. And David’s mother knew my dad, came to him and said that her son is very talented, with absolute hearing, sings songs, she feels that he should become a musician. But on what tool? Who could he become? Dad took David's hands and says: "So these are the fingers of the cellist! There is nothing to think about, I take him to my class!"

Irina Peters: David Geringas was born in 1946 in Vilnius. The cellist and conductor. Since 1975 he has been living in Germany.

Anatoly Shenderovas: He reached very large heights, but the beginning was in Vilnius with my dad. After Goeringas received the first prize at the Tchaikovsky competition, which at that time, and now is one of the strongest and most difficult music contests in the world, he received a gold medal, and after that his career ended in the Soviet Union, they stopped releasing it. There was such a deputy minister of culture of Kukharsky, he knocked out with his fist: "While I am alive, he will not leave here!" Because invitations from the capitalist countries began to come, and it was necessary to go to Russia - to Yakutia, to Kazakhstan, to the "fraternal" republics. They already knew, in the West, and sent invitations to the Ministry of Culture and home - if they don’t send home, then you can never recognize. And when he comes home, then you know. Almost Karayan invited him. The same story was with a guidon creamy.

Irina Peters: Gidon Kremer was born in 1947 in Riga. The violinist and conductor, the founder of the Kreterat Baltika Chamber Orchestra, which includes young performers from Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and Ukraine. By the way, the other day, on February 18, in Vilnius, the Kreterat Baltika concert in part of the 20th anniversary of the collective and the 70th anniversary of the maestro Kremer will be held in the Lithuanian National Philharmonic. The music of Anatoly Shenderovas will also be performed.

Anatoly Shenderovas: Gidon Kremer simply remained during the tour. He rode together with the Lithuanian Chamber Orchestra, he seemed to take him out, because he was also half -travel. And when I took it back, I didn’t bring it back. Gidon Kremer announced to the whole world that he remained, disagree with politics. And Geringas made it differently. He simply said that in such conditions he could no longer exist as a musician. The direct path was to Israel. He submitted documents and never reached Israel. Then the transplant was a Vienna, and when he arrived there, the hunt of managers and the leaders of the Philharmonic began on him. They knew that Goeringas came. Maybe Rostropovich also helped a little, he helped his students a lot. But not everyone, this one was a favorite student, he saw his potential. And Goeringas ended up in Italy, became the first cellist, composers began to write concerts, devote him, he began to play with the orchestra. In general, he almost stayed in Italy. But Karayan personally singled out a scholarship of himself. He ended in Germany first as a scholarship, then as the first cellist in Hamburg, then moved to Berlin. Today to live in Hamburg, Berlin, Vilnius or Nemenchin, like me, does not play any role - you just sleep there, but in fact you can be everywhere today. And in those years in the West, this situation was already then. We did not have this absolutely, but it was there. Therefore, living in Hamburg, he began to ride around the world and made a world career.

Irina Peters: On the feeling of composer freedom then and now?

Anatoly Shenderovas: David Geringas recorded my cellular works. This would be my first author's record. Recorded at the company "Melody". The art council passed, an envelope was already made, all signatures were collected, we are already waiting for the record. This is the 70s. At this very time, David Gorringas has a conflict in Moscow, and he submits leaving. Immediately, everything that is connected with David Gorringas is superimposed on this - on the radio all his records were isolated from the listener. And I calls Zinet Natautite. Editor. But she was much larger, she was everything.

- Are you far from the studio?

- Come.

I come.

- Well, sit down. Cold? Maybe coffee? Maybe cakes?

I speak:

- What are you so?

- You know, trouble ...

And he shows me a layout that says “Record is canceled” and signature. The order came to destroy all the materials related to the recording in the presence of the director. And the director is sitting with us. Speaks:

- Well, let's destroy.

And she wraps in a piece of paper:

-Come on, put yourself somewhere.

With me, both signed that the record was destroyed. A lot of years have passed. When I received the European Prize for the works of Concerto in Do, it was 2002, Dreyer Gaido released the CD, and they turned on the original record, film, still mono.

Irina Peters: Is that saved?

Anatoly Shenderovas: Here is the saved record, with all this story, everything was inscribed there. And you can even make out the surname who signed.

Irina Peters: Can you say what last name?

Anatoly Shenderovas: I don't know.

Irina Peters: Was there a sense of protest?

Anatoly Shenderovas: This was already directly. We repeated very actively Russian-Turkic expressions that have remained with us for life, unfortunately. The protest was probably most expressed. They always tried to worry less, and do something more in response. And then they began to think about another record.

Irina Peters: Concerto in Do, author - Anatoly Shenderovas. They are performed by David Goeringas and the Lithuanian National Symphony Orchestra under the direction of Robertas Shervenikas.

(Music)

Anatoly Shenderovas: With age, when you celebrate your first anniversary, and there is only one anniversary, it is 50 years, and 60, 70 and so on is no longer a anniversary. How is the Bible said? Count seven times for seven years. There will be 49. The next year-the 50th-declare your anniversary. And let it be your anniversary. And in these years, it is necessary to forgive debts, it is necessary to do good deeds, a lot of things, but it is not said that someone else forgave my debts.

Irina Peters: Did you manage to take such steps at 50?

Anatoly Shenderovas: All my steps are concerts. At the age of 50, there was a solemn concert in the Philharmonic with a symphony orchestra. It seemed that there is a beginning and you always live. And now I think so that we must always live, but the calls are separate ... God took the opportunity to know, you only know the first figure, but the second exists, unfortunately. This is an ax that is always over a person. What he hangs calls for life, precisely to life, statements with musical sounds.

Irina Peters: About working on music for the film "Ghetto". He was shot in Vilnius on the tragic history of the Vilnius ghetto during the Second World War. Jewish melody.

Anatoly Shenderovas: My dad was a real internationalist. I am to them too. This is the one that does not focus in its nation, in its limitations. In this sense, he was a little different, he was an internationalist, forgetting about nationality. Because at that time, if you had not forgotten, then you would have forgotten. In the Soviet years, the first and, in my opinion, the only one sang Jewish songs in the Soviet years, she was allowed. Sang on Yiddish songs. And they came here from Riga, came from Moscow. “You, in the Baltic states,” they said, “you are a foreigner, you have a different way, you can have it.” My roots at the genetic level jumped on my parents, they fall into my grandfather direct fire. He was a smuggler in a symphony orchestra, he was a violinist, a trumpeter, and on the Altushka, as he said, played. "Altushka" is a wind instrument, not an alt, not a string. More precisely, he was Clezmer, real. We had a special intimacy. Today I am a successor larger than his line. A simple person is very simple, but he could somehow say that he would remain for life. He said: "Children, you better offend me than I am at you."

(Music)

Anatoly Shenderovas: It comes time to write memoirs. Like Teletabbi - they have come to eat or sleep. This is a very good argument - the time comes. What is it, no one knows, but comes. It’s time for me to write not only with music, but also with the words what was.

Irina Peters: Friendship, friend - did these concepts transform?

Anatoly Shenderovas: Two friends have survived. We studied almost from the first grade at school. They parted, one in Israel, one in Canada, and I am in Nemenchin. This is a very funny city for me. Not as funny as he touches me.

Irina Peters: Nemenchina - a town in the Vilnius district of Lithuania, the population is five thousand people.

Anatoly Shenderovas : I like these houses are small, I like that mail, shop, bazaar, this is all at a distance of ten meters. So, we were inseparable - Joseph, Boris and I. Three heroes. And we had friendship from morning to night. They left, we still, it was possible or impossible, supported some connections. But we are now already free, we can make a conversation on Skype, one in Canada, one in Israel, one in Lithuania, we see all three on the screen and talk only about what was: how we ran away from the lessons, how we caused parents ... These are all sorts of stories that were incredibly important at that time, today are absolutely not important. The past connects us, but the past without the present has no future. Now I accidentally said aphorism.

Irina Peters: So you are not talking about the current life?

Anatoly Shenderovas: I'm trying. It doesn't work out. I say that the record came out ... "Oh! Good! How much did you pay?"

Irina Peters: newly acquired friends are already in adulthood - great luck. It is generally difficult to get friends when you are 40-50.

Anatoly Shenderovas: There are close friends, there are even almost friends. This word "almost" does not allow to miss something. The artist, they say, is a lonely person. I do not feel lonely, but absolutely close people I am not sure of what I have.

Irina Peters: It happens that you enjoy loneliness?

Anatoly Shenderovas: No, I do not like loneliness. If beautiful, I want to share that it is beautiful.

Irina Peters: With whom else did life come from great?

Anatoly Shenderovas: Krshishtof Penderetsky came many times, even with Rostropovich, they wrote about him in the newspaper Sovetskaya Lithuania. I come to him, bring this newspaper, there is his portrait and it says: "The first cello of the world" and my signature. He took a fountain pen immediately and immediately writes: "You greatly exaggerated my successes, but thank you very much for it!"

Irina Peters: How do you relate to the opinion that there used to be people, heroes, and now - shallow -grass. What do you think about this?

Anatoly Shenderovas: The attitude to his profession, to art and music in the world has completely changed.

Irina Peters: Commercialized?

Anatoly Shenderovas: I don't even know. But the words "commerce" were not at all. I remember these people, Alexander Livont is the famous violinist, my dad, who, if they have outlined a concert, the performance of a new work, then they no longer allowed each other to live. Balcis told me. Call. Alexander Livont calls him. At this time, he taught his second violin concert.

- What are you doing right now? (On the clock for two in the morning.)

- I'm lunch.

- Can you listen?

Balsis looked at his watch - 2 a.m.

- I'm lunch.

- Well, well, it will not cool. I will play different options for you.

Balsis listens, he began to play various options. Balsis listens, they talk. The levant has time, day and night.

Irina Peters: Creative people.

Anatoly Shenderovas: He sits day and night, in the literal sense, the idea comes, he calls right away, he does not look at his watch. He says that today it is planned to fulfill his great composition, the performers never disturbed him: how is the situation? Am I writing it? Or maybe I can't do it? Maybe I will not write? Curiosity: well, give me at least see the line? No! I can’t understand this anymore, I refuse!

Irina Peters: What warms you most in life?

Anatoly Shenderovas: What I do. And sad, and cheerful, and funny, and I can express it in a musical language. Maybe not as a direct answer to life, because I do not think that music is a reflection of life. No, on the contrary, music is what I would like to be life. These are our dreams, our reactions. They say that modern music is ugly. Is our life beautiful now? What life, such and art. And I think - on the contrary, the worse outside the window, the better for art, because it has the opportunity to push away from.

Irina Peters: good music can change the bad world?

Anatoly Shenderovas: No, art cannot change the world, but it changes the world when it happens. If music, then it sounds. It sounds 20 minutes, and 20 minutes, a person who moved away from life, from today, goes somewhere with dreams. At this time, the world is changing. There is no such thing that the world can be changed. Все у Экклезиаста сказано – что было, то будет.

(Music)

Ирина Петерс: Свои мысли о жизни словами и музыкой высказывал композитор Анатолий Шендеровас.