Jehovah's Witnesses

Is there a freedom of conscience in Russia: the religious scholar, lawyer and supporter of the prohibited religious organization argue

Yakov Krotov: Our program is dedicated to the next turn in religious freedom (or in religious lack of freedom) in Russia. There was a centralized ban on a religious organization - "Jehovah's Witnesses."

Our guest in the Moscow studio is the religious scholar Mikhail Sitnikov , the head of the Internet publication "Religolis" , and lawyer Vladimir Ryakhovsky ; According to Skype from Minsk - Anton Chivchalov , one of the members of the Jehovah's Witnesses movement.

I want to start a program with a small interview, taken in Moscow from a member of the Jehovah's Witnesses Movement Daria Averochkina .

We will look for other ways, but we will not refuse to serve

Daria Averochkina: The question arises of how to continue to make service, because joint meetings are one and the most important parts of the worship of Jehovah's Witnesses, according to the model of the first Christians: they were going to place the scripture, communicate, share experience. Now this is a big problem, but I do not think that it will somehow hurt. We will look for other methods, but we will not refuse ministry. Everyone will decide for himself, but perhaps we will not have such large -scale events in order not to attract great attention.

In addition, an appeal was submitted, and we still hope for a positive outcome of this case. As for literature, restrictions are imposed on it in our country, but literature is rather a secondary element of service. All the teachings of Jehovah's witnesses rely on the Bible, on the Holy Scriptures. Maybe it will not be easy - walking along the street, it is open to say that you are Jehovah's Witness, pay attention to certain places in the Scriptures, but the freedom of choice of religion cannot be limited by anyone.

Jehovah's Witnesses in the Soviet Union were prohibited, repressed

We have the experience of previous generations: Jehovah's Witnesses in the Soviet Union were prohibited, repressed. But even in camps, in prisons, with strict control, it was still the opportunity to discuss some thoughts in small groups.

Yakov Krotov: Vladimir Vasilievich, you are not only a lawyer, but also a member of the Human Rights Council under the President of Russia . As I understand it, Jehovah's witnesses sent letters to officials in Russia and abroad with a request to somehow protect them. Was there any reaction from the Council?

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: I am familiar with letters and appeals that came from around the world to the top leadership of our country, to the prosecutor's office and the court. They even said that such an influx of letters at one address at the same time worthy of entering into the Guinness Book of Records. So people showed their unity.

There was an appeal to the Human Rights Council, and, of course, our Council will respond to this. On behalf of the Council, I was delegated by the observer at the hearing: all the days, unfortunately, I could not be present, but on the first day I was at the meeting.

On May 22, a special meeting of the Council was scheduled not to this particular situation, but in general, the protection of rights to freedom of religion in our country. Including, the subject of discussion will be both the law of Yarova in terms of limiting missionary activities, and the concept of extremist activity in relation to the promotion of religious exclusivity or superiority: this is precisely the basis by which Jehovah's Witnesses were recognized as an extremist organization.

On May 22, a special meeting of the Council was scheduled to protect the rights to freedom of religion in Russia

And now a new problem is that a bill has been introduced to the State Duma, which imposes on religious groups the obligation to notify about its activities and providing for liability for non -fulfillment of this requirement. And repeated violation of the law (that is, more than twice) is already the basis for liquidation. On May 22, our council intends to consider such a wide range of issues.

Yakov Krotov: Are you personally for or against a court decision on Jehovah's Witnesses?

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: One of the first laws of the new Russia was a law on the rehabilitation of victims of political repressions, according to which everyone who was convicted of the Soviet period under Article 227 was in the editorial office of the Criminal Code of 1960 ... we are talking about "the activities of a group of citizens under the guise of religious rites associated with the cause of harm to the health of citizens, violation of public order." The majority of clergymen, including Jehovah's witnesses, were convicted under this article. Moreover, Jehovah's witnesses in 1951–53 were relocated from Western Ukraine, from Belarus, eight thousand Jehovah's witnesses were exiled to Siberia and the Far East.

And according to the law on the rehabilitation of victims of political repression, if there was eviction, if they were convicted under this article, then even without verification and revising the validity of the prosecution, they were subject to rehabilitation. A large number of believers, including Jehovah's witnesses, were rehabilitated by this law. And until now, the older generation uses the benefits that are provided for by our law regarding the victims of political repression.

And what has changed since that time? Have Jehovah's Witnesses changed? No, they remained the same, one of the most conservative in the religious sphere! Or something has changed in our "kingdom"? What should we now cancel the rehabilitation law or wait for people to be prosecuted, and then wait for a new law on rehabilitation?

If this decision remains in force, then landings are simply inevitable! Some say that they will not plant, but how will they not, if there is a criminal article - participation in the activities of the organization, in respect of which a court decision on liquidation or prohibition as an extremist organization was made? True, this decision has not yet entered into force ...

Yakov Krotov: That is, as Wahhabis in Tatarstan.

If this court decision remains in force, then landings are simply inevitable!

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: If a decision on liquidation and ban is made in relation to them, then participation in this activity is Article 282.2 "Organization of the Assembly of a Forbidden Organization" - up to ten years in prison. The “activists” called law enforcement agencies, said that “there is a meeting of Jehovah's Witnesses,” and they are obliged to respond, initiate the case, and the court must pass the conviction, because there is a formal composition - the organization of the prohibited organization. And there are 175 thousand of them! And what should we wait for?

Yakov Krotov: And if a person sits down, and he has a certificate of victim of political repression?

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: When a rehabilitation law was adopted, the law on amendments was adopted on the same day, and this article was excluded from the Criminal Code (if I am not mistaken, this is October 1991). And in 2012, Article 239 , which speaks of participation in the activities and organization of the activities of a religious organization, which is associated with an encroachment on either one, was imperceptibly in the Criminal Code. That is, in 2012, the 227th article was restored.

By the way, I am also a victim of repression, because from four years to three years I was left without a father who was convicted under the 227th article of the Criminal Code, and he was later rehabilitated.

Yakov Krotov: My father was imprisoned according to the 58th article, when I was 9 months old, was released in 18 years, and while trying to rehabilitate in 1992, my brother received the answer that the father of the father, stored in Lubyanka, burned down. He was sitting in a Lefortovo prison, and it seems to me completely impossible. My father is innocent, and I can only want to punish the perpetrators, but as a Christian I forgive them.

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: It never occurred to me, although I had every reason to seek this status, but now I think that it is necessary to do this to show what we have come to and what has changed.

Yakov Krotov: Mikhail Nikolaevich, and the Russian Orthodox Church is not tied in this situation? In the 70-80s, the “raids” led atheists to witnesses, and since the 90s the first criticism of witnesses comes from the Orthodox. Did this contribute to the current turn of events?

The attitude of the church towards foreignness began to gradually become the norm in secular society. Russian means Orthodox

Mikhail Sitnikov: In the 90s, the criticism of witnesses then only raised their heads with Orthodox anti-cultists or sectors, as they are called in the church, was very timid, delicate, it was produced inside the church community, did not go out into the street. Everything changed quite sharply somewhere by the end of the 90s, clearly-in the early 2000s, when the completely normal criticism of other religious directions within the church began to gradually pour into the secular space and fix it when it began to gradually acquire the character of a certain social norm. That is, the attitude of the Church to foreigner began to gradually become the norm in secular society. Russian means Orthodox. Orthodox - it means that the Orthodox intra -core position should adhere to.

Sectolation, as intra -church, religious discipline, has now become almost a replacement for science, a replacement of religious studies. We have a huge number of people who have nothing to do with religious studies. These are sectors who are members of missionary departments and centers. They are positioned in the media and anywhere as religious scholars, and their opinion, that is, the opinion of the Church in relation to certain believers, is broadcast in secular space and works in it.

Vladimir Vasilievich very correctly noted that the only reason for which the Supreme Court could cling to Jehovah's Witnesses is the recognition of the exclusivity of his faith. But this property is inherent in absolutely all religions, from shamanism to Christianity! On the basis of recognition by believers, the exclusivity of your religion can be closed to anyone, but do not close, for some reason they closed some witnesses.

What has now happened with witnesses is frank stupidity from the point of view of administration

But this process, which became noticeable in the 2000s, is the entry of anti-culturalists and the provision of religious doctrine, church, clerical, ideological moments of the executive branch-to our time reached the climax. It turned into stupidity! What has now happened with witnesses is frank stupidity from the point of view of administration.

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: The law has a whole list of grounds on which this or that organization or activity can be attributed to extremist. In relation to Jehovah's witnesses, only this requirement was applied - propaganda of religious exclusivity and superiority. The media talk a lot about blood transfusion, about obsessive proposals to read the Bible and other things, but there is nothing in the case, and this is the only basis by which their printed materials were recognized as extremist. And eight local religious organizations are eliminated, again, only on this basis.

Michael correctly said: what is exclusivity and superiority? I adhere to my faith only because for me it is the most correct, the most true, and therefore I confess it, so I belong to this religious unification. How can it be different? But what about the statements that there is no salvation outside the bosom of the Orthodox Church?

To whom the church is not a mother, God is not a father

Yakov Krotov: To whom the church is not a mother, God is not a father.

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: Yes! I'm not talking about the "Orthodoxy or death" recognized by extremist. I am familiar with many materials in the case of Jehovah's Witnesses, and one of the issues of their magazine gives a testimony of one woman who says: "I was looking for God for a very long time, I was looking for the truth, I went to it-there is something wrong, not that, but I came to Jehovah's Witnesses and saw that it was exactly what my soul was looking for." And on this basis they are recognized as extremists! We have a decision of the Plenum of the Supreme Court that critical statements to religious organizations cannot be recognized as extremist.

According to the already held court decision, I would single out two of its components. First of all, we can talk about the legal assessment of this decision: how legal and justified it is. I think this does not stand up to criticism! Why are the central organization claims on the basis of decisions on "extremist literature" made in relation to local organizations? The decision was made to recognize extremist and liquidate the managerial center and 395 local religious organizations. These organizations filed a petition for entry, but they were refused, and the court considers them simply as structural units. But what are these structural units? They are independent legal entities, and the fact that their charters indicate that they are part of the structure of the managerial center is just directly provided for in the Law on Freedom of Conscience that religious organizations are created and act in accordance with their own institutional and hierarchical structure and provide confirmation of entering the canonical, hierarchical structure. But these are not structural units, they are not branches or representative offices, but independent legal entities. So on what basis was the decision made in their regard, and they were not involved in participation in the case?

There are a lot of legal issues here. Of course, the court has so far only announced the resolution of the decision, we will still watch how he motivates it. But I can’t understand the political component of this decision! Who benefits from it? We put illegally 170 thousand people! Our government has analysts who could tell her about what will happen tomorrow? Plant?

Mikhail Sitnikov: This is just an illustration of what I called stupidity! But here is not even stupidity, but an extremely serious dishonesty and violation of the principles of law.

We put illegally 170 thousand people!

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: Provocation.

Mikhail Sitnikov: It is likely! The mixture of the religious aspect, according to which all Jehovah's witness organizations feel their community in faith, and the legal aspect, according to which each organization is independent and cannot be a structural unit of the center, which, incidentally, does not walk the streets and does not offer magazines to anyone.

And back to your question, Father Jacob, about the role of the Russian Orthodox Church. Since the beginning of the 2000s, the Church as a social structure with religious motivation began to gradually turn into a certain political and administrative instrument, with the help of the church it was easier to privatize and select some territories, to receive monuments at its disposal.

By the way, now the St. Petersburg temples required by the Russian Orthodox Church are at the disposal of some completely outsiders, of course, believers, the Orthodox, but not the Russian Orthodox Church: these are oligarchs, businessmen, administrators.

So, since the beginning of the 2000s, when the church began to turn into an instrument, it naturally increased the struggle with its competitors in the religious market. The number of Orthodox in the world is reduced - these are statistics. The number of parishioners in Russia is also reduced, we can observe this with our own eyes. If last year there were 3.4% of visitors to Easter in the temples, then this year - 2.9. And this is throughout Russia, this is according to the reports of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, where, of course, there is some other complimentation.

For the church as an administrative subject, naturally to somehow raise his renoma. But how to raise? We have no theology. Seminary, the Academy is gaining and issuing any of anyone. Our bishops are busy with anything other than caring for the church. Our highest authorities are engaged in high politics, as we know from open media, and as for the information that flow from the church, sometimes I do not want to talk about it.

Since the beginning of the 2000s, the Church began to gradually turn into a certain political and administrative instrument

For such an administrative subject, the course corresponding to the style of his chefs is completely natural - to use power levers. Since the law does not allow you to close the same Jehovah's Witnesses, it means that this must be done by any possible means. About corruption - not financial, but a purely "business" corruption of the church and the state - we know, we read about this even in state newspapers. And why not say: listen, they bother us, the number of followers grows too quickly, let's close them, and the rest, you look, are frightened. Still very simple! We are in Russia. We are not where people think about how they will look, what they will say about them whether they will hold their hand or not.

Anton Chivchalov: Today, both of me and many others are often asked about the causes. It is very difficult to judge them. Just a few days ago, I talked with Crimean journalists, they also asked about the reasons, and I said that for almost 30 years we had no problems with the same Ministry of Justice, there were no complaints about us. Our literature has never been recognized as extremist, and the same ministe had nothing against it. We were registered and re -registration.

And unexpectedly in 2009, our literature suddenly became extremist, and immediately dozens of publications, despite the fact that Jehovah's Witnesses in the vast majority do not violate any laws. I am convinced that even today, in April 2017, neither faith nor the practice of Jehovah's Witnesses contradicts any law of the Russian Federation. For example, they like to say that Jehovah's Witnesses do not serve in the army, but there is an alternative civil service.

No law is violated! But at the same time, we unexpectedly become extremists, and now we are terrorists, we are included in the list of such terrorist organizations as the Islamic State, al-Qaeda prohibited in Russia ... Why is this happening? Obviously, there is some external influence on state power, maybe some kind of political or religious order. For example, those who were at the hearings in the Supreme Court heard that some publications that were thrown by Jehovah's witnesses to their liturgical buildings belonged to the antisectant Orthodox center, that is, the antisectant center takes its prohibited publications and throws us.

No law is violated, but we suddenly become extremists

If we knew the reason, we would probably have done something to solve the problem, but we can only guess what drives the Ministry of Justice, which drives officials who want peaceful, law-abiding Christians to call extremists and terrorists.

A very interesting material was published on Echo of Moskvy - the warning of the prosecutor’s office from Tatarstan to a citizen, who at home, along with his co -religionists, simply reads the Bible and prays. This sounds surprisingly: "The verification conducted by the employees of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Russia established that such and such, being an unofficial representative of the Jehovah's Witnesses movement, in a house located at such an address, periodically for reading the Bible and making prayers, organizes meetings with the advisers." That is, the forces of law enforcement agencies are abandoned to look for who reads the Bible and where, who prays and where, and then tax their fines and criminal terms.

I really want to hope that the court of appeal will make the only right and fair decision. But if he does not accept him, I am afraid that we are on the verge of some religious genocide and, of course, catastrophic discrediting of the judicial system of our country, which cannot distinguish real criminals from imaginary.

Yakov Krotov: I will also allow myself to quote the definition of the prosecutor, which Anton Nikolaevich spoke of. After all, there is still such a paragraph that since the suspension of the activities of the religious organization "Management Center for Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia", the rights of this religious organization and the structures of local religious organizations included in it are suspended. They are forbidden to use, organize, conduct pickets, use bank deposits and so on. And this ban extends to a completely private person who invited friends to read the Bible, because they are members of an extremist organization. It is not even necessary to adopt the law on religious groups, the project of which has now been included in the Duma, because there are already enough qualifications as extremist - and the home assembly is prohibited.

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: I would not quite agree with this logic. First of all, there was an administrative decision of the Ministry of Justice on the suspension of activity, and under the law they have the right to apply to the court with a claim for the liquidation of the organization, to make a decision to suspend the organization’s activities before the court decision. The court decision took place. According to this decision, the Lights of the Ministry of Justice is completely satisfied, the management center was liquidated, 395 organizations were liquidated, and all property belonging to the center and local organizations is subject to contacting the state. The court decision regarding the termination of the activities of the religious organization, that is, the center and local organizations are subject to immediate execution.

There was no decision that the ideology of Jehovah's Witnesses itself is prohibited

So what do we have today? The decision that has not entered into legal force on the liquidation of 395 organizations and the decision to terminate the activities that are subject to immediate execution. But if a person who adheres to the creed of Jehovah's Witnesses in private at home held a meeting, even with his co-religionists, is this a violation of the court decision? If you approach strictly from the point of view of the letter of the law, then no. The decision was made in relation to religious organizations, they were liquidated, and criminal liability was established for participating in the activities of prohibited organizations.

Is it possible to take such a position to these citizens that “we are not participating in the activities of the organization that is liquidated, and we were going to pray in private”? Can! There was no solution, as in the ideology of fascism, that ideology itself is prohibited. There is no such thing that it is forbidden to adhere to this belief, but in practice, I am sure, this will be applied this way: the prosecutor's office of Tatarstan has already claimed that a citizen at home organized reading the Bible and prayers.

The same thing was in Taganrog - in 2009, the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses was eliminated, banned, in 2012 the operational video of their meeting was made, and in 2015 16 people were convicted, found guilty under Article 282.2 of the Criminal Code. Let them receive conditional terms, even if these were fines, but with respect to 16 people, convictions were issued. They took this position: the local religious organization of the city of Taganrog “Jehovah's Witnesses” was liquidated, we do not resume it, we organized a religious group that is not related to that organization, and this is a collection of a religious group. But this did not work, they were accused of organizing and participating in the activities of a liquidated organization.

In 2015, the law appeared in the law that the religious group should notify state bodies of their creation and the beginning of activity. Can Jehovah's Witnesses now send notifications to the Ministry of Justice about the creation of groups and the beginning of activity? Can. Are there any reason to refuse them? The decision was made in relation to the faith of Jehovah's Witnesses or in relation to the organization? In relation to the organization!

Mikhail Sitnikov: This is from the point of view of law, but here we have another factor - “ATU!”, And that’s all.

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: And the one who has more ... is right.

Yakov Krotov: More official instructions.

After the court decision entered into force, we will already say: "Jehovah's Witnesses are an organization that was liquidated as extremist"

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: Today we are calmly saying “Jehovah's Witnesses”, the “Management Center of Jehovah's Witnesses”, “Local Organizations of Jehovah's Witnesses”, without any reservations. But according to the Media Law, after the entry into force of the court decision, we will already say: "Jehovah's witnesses are an organization that was liquidated as extremist."

Yakov Krotov: I agree, but then I will talk about the Moscow Patriarchate - "permitted in the Russian Federation." (Laugh.) Not yet prohibited ...

Mikhail Sitnikov: It will not work, we are still in Russia.

Yakov Krotov: I am afraid, the majority of the population of Russia, and the Orthodox, in particular, are generally sure that Jehovah's Witnesses are not Christians. And in many manuals, in school manuals, I saw: they pass through a completely separate part. But after all, at the meetings of the witnesses, Jehovah read the Holy Scriptures in a synodal translation, and this was emphasized during the process, that is, the accusations that "these non -Christ distorted the Word of God," are unfair.

At the meetings of Jehovah's witnesses, the Holy Scriptures are read in a synodal translation

Anton Nikolaevich, how much are you personally and, perhaps, other Jehovah's witnesses are ready to try to adapt to the system? So I know that many Protestants are now writing not the “Pastor’s Cabinet”, but the “abbess”-it sounds as if in a vocational one. Are Jehovah's Witnesses weak in such a situation as in Taganrog, to gather and say: “But we are not Jehovah's witnesses, for example, we are the Orthodox faiths of the gospel - to change the name? Or is it fundamentally for you that these are Jehovah's Witnesses?

Anton Chivchalov: This resembles how some Pentecostal groups now celebrate Easter, consecrate Easter cakes.

It seems to us that these persecution and persecution are not connected with the name. For example, we were not always called "Jehovah's Witnesses", our group was once called "Bible researchers." After all, the point is not the name, but rather in the exercises that we confess, which we want to convey to our neighbors. We proceed from the fact that terminology should be biblical: this is how it is written in the Bible, so we try to speak.

But we do not think that if we change something in terms, it will suddenly help us find someone's favor. We can go to some compromise due to what is located within the Bible. If, without leaving the biblical framework, we compromise with someone, then we can talk about this, but if it leaves the biblical framework, goes beyond the limits of God's commandments, then we do not go to such a compromise.

We can go to some compromise due to what is in the Bible

And the biblical story teaches: when the people of God, for example, ancient Israel, tried to compromise with some surrounding peoples, it inevitably ended very badly for him. But when this people began to rely on God and saw his hope in God, God saved him. We believe that in modern conditions it is also necessary to adhere to this biblical principle, universal for all times.

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: However, no one offers them this compromise. This is an uncompromising decision. But you need to know Jehovah's Witnesses and their history. They are the only ones who did not go to any compromises in fascist Germany, they stood firmly. In Stalin's times, the same thing. The rest, even the Protestants, somehow adapt, go underground ...

Yakov Krotov: Is it a compromise underground?

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: Yes. But Jehovah's witnesses as they went to their meetings and meetings will go, and you will not stop them with threats of criminal prosecution. Really those who made this decision ... And this, I am sure, was a decision not to go to court ... throughout the country and the prosecutor's office and the Ministry of Internal Affairs, these shares were initiated regarding literature and trials: this campaign is probably dictated from some one center. And the Ministry of Justice simply acted as a conductor of this action.

Yakov Krotov: Over the past ten years, there were now and then pieces of paper and copies of pieces of paper that called the organization that jerks the strings, and this organization - the FSB. Letters to the heads of institutions, letters to the prosecutor’s office - from the FSB!

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: We all understand what this is talking about.

There is a title denomination, and her label is fashionable to have anywhere: not only in the FSB, but also in the army

Mikhail Sitnikov: Any state departments, including the illegal department - the Russian Orthodox Church, of course, represent a fairly serious force and are coordinated. But for the FSB, in my opinion, there is no difference between witnesses, victims, Orthodox, Catholics, Pentecostals. Who needs to extinguish those who interfere? Only those who are jealous.

Yakov Krotov: But if they do not see the difference, then why does the FSB have more than three dozen official Orthodox churches, starting from the temple on the tasks of the "children's world", where is it difficult to go, because it is one complex with the new FSB building? But you will not find a single Protestant temple at the FSB.

Mikhail Sitnikov: Because we have a title denomination, and her label is fashionable to have anywhere: not only in the FSB, but also in the army.

Vladimir Ryakhovsky: But in what position is the community of witnesses to Jehovah Crimea now? In 2015, they entered the Ministry of Justice’s recommendations in the Management Center, they were there for only one and a half years, and there were re -registration according to Russian law. There are about 20 communities, and today they are liquidated. They have nothing to do with the warning that was issued by the managerial center. Is this a balanced political decision? I'm not talking about the fact that this is illegal, unreasonable. This is just a stupid solution!

This is not so much stupidity as a challenge to the free world, part of which are Jehovah's Witnesses

​ Яков Кротов: Я думаю, контору ФСБ можно обвинить в чем угодно, но не в глупости.

Михаил Ситников: В данном случае в глупости можно обвинять не ФСБ, не кого-то отдельно, а всю эту ситуацию. Ситуация вылилась в неправовую, аморальную глупость и, более того, в совершенно деструктивную акцию!

Яков Кротов: А я все-таки убежден, что это не столько глупость, сколько вызов свободе, свободному миру, частью которого являются и Свидетели Иеговы. И хочу выразить надежду, что и Свидетели, и православные, и протестанты найдут ненасильственный, но решительный ответ и с Божьей помощью победят все силы, которые ограничивают свободу веры!

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  Yakov Krotov

  Historian and priest, leading Radio Freedom Radio "Between Vera and Belief"

  ykrotov@yahoo.com