"The new sanctions list always follows"

Who and for what reasons were chosen by defendants for a new sanctions list and whether it is possible to achieve an exclusion from it - The New Times asked the famous economist Anders Audond from the Washington Atlantic Council

NT: *judging by what is written in the documents of OFAC (Office for Foreign Asset Control - an office for monitoring foreign assets of the US Department of Finance), 24 names and 15 companies were punished for the Crimea, and for the war in the east of Ukraine, and for intervention in the presidential election in the US In Syria. At the same time, it remains unclear by what principle certain businessmen were chosen, certain companies. What is the procedure? *

Anders Aperend : the process is headed by the Ministry of Finance, the Director of National Intelligence ( DNI - seventeenth member of the US intelligence community, which has 16 organizations; DNI is a daily secret review of intelligence data for the US president. - NT) - they, based on intelligence data, including financial intelligence included in the US Department of Finance, make their list, which is then transferred to the State Department to the State Department And to the National Security Council. Each of them makes a choice based on their priorities: the State Department - based on political goals, the Ministry of Finance - financial, economic, security council (NSC) coordinates the process.

NT: *And who specifically puts the last point? *

As a rule, the Deputy Minister of Finance (Under Secretary of Treasury), which oversees the terrorism office and financial intelligence, now this is Sigal Mandelker, she was fought for many years to launder money and is very strictly related to those who do similar. For the current leadership of the US Department of Finance, the laundering of money is the most important topic: according to their data, $ 300 billion is laundered every year through the United States, and therefore they will act very rigidly against those who have similar data. For example, Suleiman Kerimov was on the list exactly for this reason - money laundering in France.

NT: *But there was no court yet? *

I think the Ministry of Finance has enough information on this case - they believe that the facts that they have are sufficient to win a lawsuit in a civil court. Well, besides, Kerimov was involved in strange financial relations with the cellist Sergei Roldugin ( friend of Putin’s youth. - NT) - this was in Panama papers. For similar reasons - an accusation of money laundering in Spain - Vladislav Reznik also got on the list: I have no doubt that financial intelligence has and, therefore, OFAC has enough actual material. And in the same company Andrei Akimov, the head of Gazprombank.

NT: *Why did Deripaska and Vekselberg get the list, for example - say, Abramovich and Usmanov? All are close to Putin, and the last two, according to rumors, is even closer than those who are now fighting for the survival of their companies? *

I will say right away: from my point of view, Vekselberg is a terrible mistake: it is not suitable for a sanctions list by any criteria. This is unfair and unlawful.

NT: *if so, can it be excluded from the list? *

No.

NT: *and through the court? *

Theoretically - yes, but practically - no. Various banks were fined by the US government at $ 230 billion - not a single case, not one! - It was not allowed through the court.

NT: *that is, trying to sue the US government is practically useless? *

Yes.

NT: *Let's get back to the question: on what principles did the names select? *

First, people from Putin’s near environment were selected. Further - they allocated those who were involved in laundering money. The next group is those who are suspected of interfering with the US presidential election - for example, Deripaska’s relationship with Manaforto M ( head of the candidate Trump’s election headquarters in the summer of 2016. - NT) made him a serious suspect. Plus - those Russian businessmen who, one way or another, or their CEO, gave money to American elections. For example, Vekselberg and his companions are suspected that he or his partners gave it to the elections, and then to the inauguration of Trump, something about $ 6 million or, for example, Alexander Torshin , deputy head of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation: he was in a sanctions list because he was associated with the NRA ( National Rifle Association-a national rifle association, which is traditionally It supports the election of a candidate from the Republican Party. Further - Konstantin Kosachev, he is accused of in some way he was involved in cyber attacks. The head of Surgutneftigaz Bogdanov is an absolutely opaque company, and there is reason to believe that it is a third - the property of the first person.

The imposition of sanctions on Deripaska’s companies - I do not exclude that Trump is interested in reducing the production of aluminum in the world. And Rusal is 7% of world production of aluminum. I think that the Deripaska itself was on the sanctions list is fair. But I am categorically opposed to the sanctions to be introduced against businesses, because now the same “russal” will simply be nationalized by the Russian state. And who will benefit from this? Yes, Putin.

NT: *American holders of stock packages in Deripaska’s companies should sell their shares until May 5, 2018 - that is, in just a month. Why is it so hard? *

This is the principle: if they ( the American state. - NT) decide to beat, then they really beat.

Thus, not only Deripaska itself was punished, but also investors and creditors of his companies. It seems to me that this is unfair. It seems to me that it is impossible to apply sanctions against private companies, it seems to me that if you impose sanctions, then they must be applied to state -owned companies. For example, VTB Bank - significantly less stringent sanctions were introduced against it earlier. VTB still has an office in New York. And Vnesheconombank-he also has an office in New York.

By the way, I heard that it was originally assumed that there will be 35 names on the list - this is proven information.

NT: *But they say that there will be the next list? *

There is always a new list - for example, I expect Alisher Usmanov in the next list. In the current list, his younger partner, Andrei Skoch.

As for Abramovich, he is known for his friendship with Ivanka Trump and Gerald Kushner - there is a suspicion that it was this influential married couple that protected him from sanctions.

NT: *The Russian government announced that it would take response. What can they be? *

The Russian government always says this, but in fact it can do little. Russia's GDP - $ 1.4 trillion, US GDP - $ 90 trillion, Russia depends on foreign trade, the USA - practically no. So Russia has few answer options, and it is doomed to the behavior of the marginal - cyber attacks, information stuffing. The Kremlin talked about the prohibition for flights of Russian airspace, but from this, first of all, Russia will suffer. They talked about the ban on sales of titanium - Boeing and Aerobas need it - but who will Russia sell this very titanium then?

NT: *Can similar European be followed by American sanctions? *

The European Union has its own procedure and its criteria - they will continue to follow it.

NT: *What other troubles do we need to wait from Washington? *

Müller’s new accusations (special prosecutor) - I think that this is not long to wait.