Translated material
"Russia is a great country, but ..."
How protest Belarusians live in Moscow. Interview with the coordinator of the Moscow diaspora
In December, the embassies of the new, Nelkashenkovo Belarus opened throughout Europe. People’s embassies, as activists call them. There was such an attempt in Moscow, but it did not work out: the old works, but there is no new one - the laws do not allow. And in general, the situation is not very Frendley. About how those who come out every day live with pickets to the old embassy on Maroseyka, and what difficulties they experience, says Lana Savanovich, the coordinator of the Moscow diaspora of Belarusians.
- Why did not manage to open the People’s Embassy in Moscow?
- The matter is not only at the embassy, we are generally forced to act more carefully than our friends in Europe, we have more restrictions. They simply take and do, as in Germany, where they put a wagon with a clear order, organized an information center.
It is more difficult with Russia: on the website of the people's embassies there is a Tikhanovskaya page. No more, among other things. And we have it in the interstate wanted list.
- Is the people's embassies the embassies of the Tikhanovskaya government?
- No, it is folk. Embassies of the Tikhanovskaya government in nature do not exist. The fact of the matter is that the old government is a vertical and centralization. And we have the most flat political structure that can be imagined. And certainly Tikhanovskaya is not a higher authority for us, although we maintain it and we have an excellent relationship. Cooperate - we cooperate, obey - do not obey.
-So why not opened?
- Just in case, we consulted with a lawyer, he warned that the reaction of the authorities could be very sharp. Well, the embassy is impossible, let there be an information center. Work with media is also important. But no: the information center is the distribution of information, work with the press ... "Sorry, but this is the media, and foreign." And that means it is also impossible. The only wording that the lawyer said “well, probably yes,” is the point of assistance to compatriots, Belarusians living in the Russian Federation. In principle, we are already doing this, this is the consular function that we took upon ourselves back in September, in addition to helping repressed in our homeland, pickets, and videos. We do what any embassy does, any consulate. Moving to another country, you get on consular records. If necessary, the consulate finds you a lawyer and generally helps. This is what we do.
- Why doesn’t the official consulate do this?
- Must be engaged. But the situation has changed, and they did not adapt to it. They do not help new Belarusians. And it is necessary. I got in a difficult situation - the first one you call - the consul: "Listen, what to do?" A simple example. We now have a girl with Covid in the clinic. We definitely do not expect help from the consulate, it will not be. If she is issued an account for treatment, we will collect money. We generally regularly collect for compatriots who moved to Moscow and they have nowhere to go. We place them if possible.
- Are these political refugees?
- Not always. Here we have the famous Valentina Zelenkevich, the champion of Belarus in the triathlon. She was fired for a photo with a white-red-white flag, and she was not needed by anyone. She moved to Moscow, got a job at some kind of sports club, she was taken for one day a week, put a salary as much as seven thousand rubles. And something needs to be eaten. Is she a political refugee? I don’t know, now these faces are erased. Almost all repressed for protests are repressed in criminal articles, as if not for politics.
- And how many Belarusians are in Moscow now?
- According to official statistics - 60 thousand. But this is formally. And we believe that Belarusian is no longer a nationality, it is a way of thinking. If a person for democratic changes supports the protests that we take place, he is a Belarusian. The passport is not a passport - it does not matter.
Negrouts who actively support our business, we give out certificates of Honored Belarusian. They made Makarevich, Bykov and other good people who sympathize with us. It says there: "Consider me with a Belarusian!"
-How will it be in Belarusian?
- LICHICE TAYAN Belarusians!
- Beautiful. But still: the Belarusian protest poet in Moscow is who? Students, business who came to earn money here people of working specialties?
- And students, and those who write with wild mistakes in chats, and white collars, and business owners, very successful, with Russian passports. Many stars. Rita Dakota (see the clip “Go away” ), Katya Iowo, Max Korzh ... Angelica Agurbash, whom everyone knows from the Verasses group, boldly and resolutely goes to the embassy every Sunday. Standers Usovich, Komissarenko and several more people - I can’t say that they come to our events, but they held a Belarusian stand -up, talked about protests. We understand where the security boundaries of these people, and do not expect an infinitely many from them, but we know that they are with us.
- And the "songs"?
- With the "songs" is ambiguous. I must say that they are a symbol of Belarus to a greater extent for Russians than for us. I remember that the woman came up to us for the embassy’s promotions, and then we turned on the music for passers -by (we are allowed to turn it on, then no), and says: “You are doing it all wrong. Why do you put this horror? If you want people to be involved, put the “Blovezhskaya Push”, and we will understand. ”
-But the "songs" in the end somehow speak out?
- No, they are silent, and there is a million explanations for this. Not everything is so clear for a creative person who chooses a protest. In the best case, he will simply be cut off from the possibility of performances, from earnings, but you need to understand that in Belarus, if you are an artist, you can only earn on the state. We do not have huge companies that order expensive corporate parties, these are not Moscow, there are simply no such surpluses to spend them on entertainment, especially in the pandemic. And at best, you go into the zone of a very, very hungry life. And at the worst you will go for 15 days, and you will have to flee the country, as many of our performers did.
- In Russia, it is also full of problems, including political ones. Does this concern the Belarusian diaspora or are you only busy with what is happening at home?
- He worries, but we are not discussing the policy of other countries, whether Russia or Ukraine. Just for safety reasons.
We do not quite understand what we play, but it is clear: if they want to press us, it is much easier to cling to Belarusian topics, but for Russian ones.
Good police officers hinted to us that when we begin to connect Khabarovsk and Belarus and chant “Khabarovsk! Khabarovsk! ”, For them it is a definitely much more unpleasant signal than when we scream something about our own.
In general, we try not to go by the flags. It will be bad if we are dispersed here. In addition, there are not enough mental strength to deeply immerse in the current Russian troubles. It sincerely seems to me that now the most tragic, the most terrible world - Belarus. With my mind, I understand that this is not so that terrible things are happening there and there. But when I read about the next repression in Minsk, my heart beats more often and everything else fades a little. It hurts directly, aching. You excuse me that I say that.
This is bad, it shouldn't be so. We live in Russia, and its problems cannot be indifferent to us. But it is impossible to accommodate so much.
- How does the authorities react to you? Have there been cases of arrest and detentions during these months?
-There was nothing extreme, except for the famous case when two activists climbed in St. Petersburg on the Isaac's Cathedral and turned the white-red-white flag. They took a picture, went down, and the next day they knocked on the door to one of them, they called the second, as a result, both served for two days. In August-September, the embassy was often delayed, but released. Our girlfriend was detained on Red Square, I was present. They made a protocol, although her entire offense consisted in the fact that she was with a white-red-white umbrella. Nine guys were detained almost on the same day and immediately released. They were delayed later, but in the end there were no serious sanctions. They filled out the protocols, and that’s it. We do not understand whether these protocols are holding, then to attract, or what.
Right before the New Year, the 26th, 14 people were detained in St. Petersburg from the consulate. For violation of the covid regime, as they say. They took it into the ring, said to disperse, but it became clear that no one would give them a dispersal. With one of the girls, very active, the employee from the EE center talked.
- Since when has our EE center is engaged in a covid regime?
- Well, like that. You understand everything. What a Covid ... and asked about the two more that were absent on that day.
- This means that you are carefully watching you.
“And it’s good that they are only watching for now.” We have a book of punishers of Belarus, a telegram channel, where especially retreating bosses and performers are posted-with photographs, addresses and phones. People write to them SSMESK, call. So our boyfriend who has a business here has sent someone from the Belarusian police from the Russian number of SMS. And they came to him. He believes that this was not the reason for the collision, that the reasons are purely economic. Nevertheless, he was taken to the department and conducted a preventive conversation with him. The main topic was just this SMS. He says: “It saved that there were no threats in it, I did not write that, they say, I will kill you or something else, but only:“ As you are not ashamed ... ”
And it turns out that in Russia they knew about this SMS. Apparently, there is some kind of dossier in which all this is written.
“But this is power, but there is still a layman.” When protests began in Minsk, the Russians did not delve into this much, and many did not delve into at all. There was only one question: anti -Russian protests or not? Everyone comes from this.
- You know the answer: there was not a single anti -Russian slogan. But the course of thought is clear, we have about the same. You look at any celebrity, and the first thought: "What did he say about Belarusians?" Posner once said something bad here, we are like that! And then the same Pozner spoke out in support of Belarusian journalists, and I fell in love with him again. I always really loved him.
Or they announced: Lavrov flies to Belarus. And we are all the same: “Lavrov! This is the best person in the world, such a professional, he is definitely taking some kind of message from Putin, such that Lukashenko will tremble, faint, and after that everything will change. ” Lavrov arrives, says something supporting Lukashenko, turns around and leaves. And all are: "God, what a horror, what a shame!"
Belarusian protests are anti -Lukashenkovsky, not anti -Russian. But now we are increasingly wondering: why is Russia so anti -Belorian, why is the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs today? After all, one cannot sincerely think that love can be knocked out by repression. Russia is a great country, but why is black for it white? .. We began to feel that Russia at some point became tough towards us. We do not want and will not answer her the same, but we are offended and bitter.